Thoughts about gun control

Paradox

2010-01-13 05:57:03

Got this in an email. Not being one to believe everything I read, I wonder if someone who lives in the where this story happened can corroborate the facts. In any case it brings up some interesting thoughts regarding the gun control debate that rages in the U.S.

You're sound asleep when you hear a thump outside your bedroom door. Half-awake, and nearly paralyzed with fear, you hear muffled whispers.
At least two people have broken into your house and are moving your way. With your heart pumping, you reach down beside your bed and pick up your shotgun.
You rack a shell into the chamber, then inch toward the door and open it.

In the darkness, you make out two shadows. One holds something that looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike, you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the floor. One writhes and screams while the second man crawls to the front door and lurches outside.

As you pick up the telephone to call police, you know you're in trouble. In your country, most guns were outlawed years before, and the few that are privately owned are so stringently regulated as to make them useless. Yours was never registered. Police arrive and inform you that the second burglar has died. They arrest you for First Degree Murder and Illegal Possession of a Firearm. When you talk to your attorney, he tells you not to worry: authorities will probably plea the case down to manslaughter.

"What kind of sentence will I get?" you ask.
"Only ten-to-twelve years," he replies, as if that's nothing. "Behave yourself, and you'll be out in seven."

The next day, the shooting is the lead story in the local newspaper. Somehow, you're portrayed as an eccentric vigilante while the two men you shot are represented as choirboys. Their friends and relatives can't find an unkind word to say about them. Buried deep down in the article, authorities acknowledge that both "victims" have been arrested numerous times. But the next day's headline says it all: "Lovable Rogue Son Didn't Deserve to Die." The thieves have been transformed from career criminals into Robin Hood-type pranksters. As the days wear on, the story takes wings. The national media picks it up, then the international media. The surviving burglar has become a folk hero. Your attorney says the thief is preparing to sue you, and he'll probably win. The media publishes reports that your home has been burglarized several times in the past and that you've been critical of local police for their lack of effort in apprehending the suspects. After the last break-in, you told your neighbor that you would be prepared next time. The District Attorney uses this to allege that you were lying in wait for the burglars.

A few months later, you go to trial. The charges haven't been reduced, as your lawyer had so confidently predicted. When you take the stand, your anger at the injustice of it all works against you. Prosecutors paint a picture of you as a mean, vengeful man. It doesn't take long for the jury to convict you of all charges.

The judge sentences you to life in prison.

This case really happened. On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk , England , killed one burglar and wounded a second. In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term. How did it become a crime to defend one's own life in the once great British Empire ?

It started with the Pistols Act of 1903. This seemingly reasonable law forbade selling pistols to minors or felons and established that handgun sales were to be made only to those who had a license. The Firearms Act of 1920 expanded licensing to include not only handguns but all firearms except shotguns. Later laws passed in 1953 and 1967 outlawed the carrying of any weapon by private citizens and mandated the registration of all shotguns. Momentum for total handgun confiscation began in earnest after the Hungerford mass shooting in 1987. Michael Ryan, a mentally disturbed man with a Kalashnikov rifle, walked down the streets shooting everyone he saw. When the smoke cleared, 17 people were dead.

The British public, already de-sensitized by eighty years of "gun control", demanded even tougher restrictions. (The seizure of all privately owned handguns was the objective even though Ryan used a rifle.) Nine years later, at Dunblane , Scotland , Thomas Hamilton used a semi-automatic weapon to murder 16 children and a teacher at a public school.

For many years, the media had portrayed all gun owners as mentally unstable or worse, criminals. Now the press had a real kook with which to beat up law-abiding gun owners. Day after day, week after week, the media gave up all pretense of objectivity and demanded a total ban on all handguns. The Dunblane Inquiry, a few months later, sealed the fate of the few sidearms still owned by private citizens.

During the years in which the British government incrementally took away most gun rights, the notion that a citizen had the right to armed self-defense came to be seen as vigilantism. Authorities refused to grant gun licenses to people who were threatened, claiming that self-defense was no longer considered a reason to own a gun. Citizens who shot burglars or robbers or rapists were charged while the real criminals were released. Indeed, after the Martin shooting, a police spokesman was quoted as saying, "We cannot have people take the law into their own hands." All of Martin's neighbors had been robbed numerous times, and several elderly people were severely injured in beatings by young thugs who had no fear of the consequences. Martin himself, a collector of antiques, had seen most of his collection trashed or stolen by burglars. When the Dunblane Inquiry ended, citizens who owned handguns were given three months to turn them over to local authorities. Being good British subjects, most people obeyed the law. The few who didn't were visited by police and threatened with ten-year prison sentences if they didn't comply. Police later bragged that they'd taken nearly 200,000 handguns from private citizens. How did the authorities know who had handguns? The guns had been registered and licensed.
Kind of like cars. Sound familiar?

THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND AMENDMENT IN OUR U.S. CONSTITUTION.

"..It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.." --Samuel Adams


Apparently, President Obama is planning to do similar leegislation in the U.S.? I havent heard of anything specific on the news myself, has anyone else? I do believe in our constitutional right to bear arms and its interesting to think that criminals could be emboldened by this type of strict legislation and that the concept of armed citizens could be a possible deterrant.

Uncle Rico

2010-01-13 06:55:35

badinfluence

2010-01-13 06:57:22

I understnad where people are coming from when this happens, but wouldn't it just be easier to give them your shit, get a good look at them, and file it with your house insurance?

REJECTED

2010-01-13 07:13:54

If police and military have guns, then citizens should as well, it's that simple to me. If police and military didn't have them, then I would say there is no need for them, but that will never be. Only if they were never invented would that ever be. Citizens need to be able to defend themselves against a tyranical government; it's unfortunate that there are so many petty crimes committed, and so many that have died from their use in domestic crimes.

L2k

2010-01-13 07:28:08

badinfluence wrote:I understnad where people are coming from when this happens, but wouldn't it just be easier to give them your shit, get a good look at them, and file it with your house insurance?
The problem is that you don't know what these idiots are planning to do, robbing is one thing, murdering, raping or torturing your family in lieu of money or something else is another.
As for me I will shoot first and worry about the consequences later. There was something wrong in the case example at least bad representation, but I'm sure things like that do happen to innocent people and thats just sad.

Pernicious

2010-01-13 07:31:43

Its a known fact that allowing citezens to own guns does not increase gun crime.

But the bad guys are going to get guns either way, all they are doing is fucking the legit ppl in the ass. Gun laws in Australia are really strict nowa days after there was a killing spree in Tasmania, but that guy didnt obtain his weapons legally, and had anyone else been carrying a gun obviously he would not have got very far (citizens cannot carry weapons, not even b4 the new gun laws). Once again, the legit get fucked in the ass. Politicians used the situation for their own popularity contests rather then actually being concerned about crime rates, i would like to see more availablility with super tight regulations rather then just making them illegal for the most part.

Texas is a good example yea?
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/08/20/opini ... gewanted=1

Paradox

2010-01-13 08:23:49

L2k wrote:
badinfluence wrote:I understnad where people are coming from when this happens, but wouldn't it just be easier to give them your shit, get a good look at them, and file it with your house insurance?
The problem is that you don't know what these idiots are planning to do, robbing is one thing, murdering, raping or torturing your family in lieu of money or something else is another.
As for me I will shoot first and worry about the consequences later. There was something wrong in the case example at least bad representation, but I'm sure things like that do happen to innocent people and thats just sad.

Also, if you get robbed numerous times, it gets expensive having to replace stuff over again and Im sure the insurance company is probably going to stop allowing the claims after a while.

Ko-Tao

2010-01-13 08:55:37

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson

...Likely rolling in his grave at how badly the 2nd amendment has been dragged through the muck.


"The parole board, however, has continually refused him early release - saying he has shown no remorse and would continue to pose a danger to any other burglars."

Bolded for HURRRRelevance.

Hmm, police pose a danger to burglars... lets put all the cops in jail!


"...since Gov. George W. Bush signed the law allowing Texans to carry concealed weapons, crime in the state has declined by 20 percent."

Predators prefer defenseless prey, imagine.

REJECTED

2010-01-13 09:03:19

I like the quotes and points you made, you've got some good insight on the matter.

provost

2010-01-13 09:20:59

Get crossbows.

Blasphemy

2010-01-13 12:32:16

CellarDweller

2010-01-13 17:43:55

badinfluence wrote:I understnad where people are coming from when this happens, but wouldn't it just be easier to give them your shit, get a good look at them, and file it with your house insurance?
i see this as a two-fold issue. 2nd amendment, right to bear arms... and 4th amendment, right against unreasonable searches and seizures.

ever heard the phrase, a mans home is his castle? its old english common law... apparently forgotten in britain. it illustrates the principle of individual privacy and is still fundamental to the american system of government.

regardless of what you see on tv, its not that easy to get a search warrant for a persons home. the police have to swear an oath or file an affadavit before a judge to establish probable cause. many states still require special circumstances before allowing a "no knock" search warrant. did you catch that? typical search warrants require KNOCKING ON THE DOOR BEFORE ENTERING! many states also require search warrants to be served during daylight hours, again, unless special circumstances exist. search warrants also come with time restrictions, typically they must be served within 72 hrs... or the po-po has to go back and get another search warrant through the same process. the 4th amendment is an extremely powerful right!

yes, badinfluence, a homeowner could take that route. let someone take your shit, watch your rates increase, or get cancelled altogether. keep in mind the clearance rate (solved) for burglaries in the U.S. is about 10%. most burglaries occur during daylight hours and there are no witnesses and very little evidence. the motivation for breaking into an occupied home is superficially plausable at best. its a home invasion and imho, its best to assume the worst for your/family safety.

theres another 911 tape floating around the internets from a few weeks ago. a woman in oklahoma shot a man with a shotgun after he broke into her home. its very compelling audio, you hear her anguish about what happened.

Deathwish

2010-01-13 18:51:39

Just the thought that most of you guys think its reasonable to shoot even an unarmed robber in your house means your all absolutely fucked in the head, a gun is for self protection, you un arm someone, if they have a gun yeah, shoot them, but if they dont, you guys think its reasonable to shoot them straight away instead of first just holding them there until police arrive? If a robber was reading this he'd probably be thinking hmm next time i go to rob a house i may as well kill them first since they're going to kill me anyway, lmao.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-13 19:01:35

Deathwish wrote:Just the thought that most of you guys think its reasonable to shoot even an unarmed robber in your house means your all absolutely fucked in the head, a gun is for self protection, you un arm someone, if they have a gun yeah, shoot them, but if they dont, you guys think its reasonable to shoot them straight away instead of first just holding them there until police arrive? If a robber was reading this he'd probably be thinking hmm next time i go to rob a house i may as well kill them first since they're going to kill me anyway, lmao.
Because ever robber should be able to feel secure whilst robbing someone, its just common sense.
I mean, we really shouldn't discourage such hard-earned robbing, for that is like taking jobs away from our economy; just like when US labor unions drive auto-makers to go to Mexico where the labor costs 1/10th of what it does here.

People breaking the law should should know their government will protect them from those horrible law-abiding citizens.
I mean, if the US allows law-aiders to shoot our beloved robbers and thieves, it will drive them out and send them to the robber-friendly UK.

Your right DW, we just can't have that.

Those crazy animals fearing for the livelihood of their family from some poor unknown assailant.

Goddamn them all, stupid taxpayers and honest laborers.

FUCK.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-13 19:05:02

So next time someone I don't know is unlawfully in my house, I should ask if he/she has a gun.
IF they do not, Ill just stab them - that's cool, that's cool.

K. Gotcha DW.

Sorry for being so stupid, I am.

Deathwish

2010-01-13 19:06:54

You can't have a gun for self protection in australia, we don't have high crime rate, guess we're just overall better.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-13 19:11:58

Deathwish wrote:If a robber was reading this he'd probably be thinking hmm next time i go to rob a house i may as well kill them first since they're going to kill me anyway, lmao.
And we just assume that someone breaking and entering just has a annoying drug habit and is unable to support him/herself legitimately will have a sense of honor NOT to kill us regardless of how armed or not we are.

Logically, ya, they don't want an open murder investigation.

But how the fuck do we know they are logical?
Wtf should I do? Ask about the weapon first, then offer them tea to try to ascertain just what kind of robber they are?

And I am the one who is "fucked in the head?"

Serious?

lead

2010-01-13 19:17:40

Pernicious wrote:Its a known fact that allowing citezens to own guns does not increase gun crime.

are you fucking serious man? easy access to knives is one of the reasons glasgow is the murder capital for knife crime...if guns were easier to access it would be a fuckin bloodbath!


and as for the farmer...he shot the guy in the back that is murder not self defence and the UK is still safer for not having being a gun carrying society ask the families of the victims in Dunblane...fuck all to do with the erosion of the british empire more to do with psychos

NOTnewguy

2010-01-13 19:26:49

Deathwish wrote:I am now going menstruate and say that my country is just overall better because I have no rebuttal, and newguy's posts have ripped my argument a new asshole. ...It hurts.

SND

2010-01-13 20:06:20

My personal opinion on the matter even if someone is on your property does not give you the right to take a persons life even if they broke in and scared the living shit out of you and is what would be described as a low life. If having a gun is for self defence certainly why shot a unarmed man and kill him certainly a plastic replica gun would be enough to scare the guy off or get him surrender. If you take a life you pay the penalty end of and in this country if you have a weapon and events occur where someone loses their life in the eyes of the law you had intent to take a life and so pay the penalty.

Also what with giving guns reduce crime as a fact and when has ever Texas been a template of how the rest of the world works. As lead said in a place like Glasgow or London legalising guns make things worst and actually gun crime has lowered beacause so little amount of guns around that criminals have to rent guns from their dealer.

All I can say is that im glad I don't live in a place where guns are excepted and prefer people to use other means to protecting them selfs than for some messed up kid to get hold of his parents gun and go on a killing spree in a shopping center. But rest sure if someone brakes into my property im not going to make them a cup of tea more or less going to beat the crap out of them until the police turn up.

Jelly Fox

2010-01-13 20:08:42

lead wrote:
Pernicious wrote:Its a known fact that allowing citezens to own guns does not increase gun crime.

are you fucking serious man? easy access to knives is one of the reasons glasgow is the murder capital for knife crime...if guns were easier to access it would be a fuckin bloodbath!


and as for the farmer...he shot the guy in the back that is murder not self defence and the UK is still safer for not having being a gun carrying society ask the families of the victims in Dunblane...fuck all to do with the erosion of the british empire more to do with psychos
Spot on! Being chibbed is bad enough, imagine the risk of being shot because some radge thought you skipped the queue in the chippy...I'd move up north where they're still making tools out of sticks!

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-13 20:25:31

Why yes Petdish, i do think its reasonable to blow away some intruder in your home, armed or not.
What is one supposed to do, find out if they are armed?!!??!?
I think, if they don't want shit, they don't bring shit.
Your house is your property and you have the right to defend it.
ODumba can try all he likes, he is never making America into a Euro-Trash Socialist nanny state.

Criminals don't obey the law, so who is it that is effected by Gun Laws?!?

Lets not look to Britain (ENGLAND). Britain is in serious decline. They don't give a crap anymore. Shame, when one considers its Great Empire.

Gun Laws in America would go far as to make millions of good citizens into criminals, cause they aren't giving up their arms.
Gun Laws do not make criminals become law abiding citizens.

CellarDweller

2010-01-14 00:11:16

ok sure, you can physically overcome any intruder who breaks into your home and physically control that intruder until the police arrive. good on ya. glad you're pro. hope your wife is too. and your brother. sister. mother. father. grandfather. grandmother. and your teenage son and daughter, who are quite capable of learning the safe use of firearms through any hunter safety course.

after all, every burglar in the U.S. that has ever been shot while breaking into an occupied home has been unarmed, lacking a criminal history, unintoxicated, free of drugs, mentally stable, alone, and puny. remember that wheelchair burglar... :sketchy:

here's the story about the oklahoma woman i referred to: http://maggiesnotebook.blogspot.com/200 ... -with.html

and here's the burglary that changed my pov: http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/noto ... index.html

my wife and i were living in wichita at that time. this disturbing crime happened about a mile and a half from our home.

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 00:56:51

"My personal opinion on the matter even if someone is on your property does not give you the right to take a persons life even if they broke in and scared the living shit out of you and is what would be described as a low life"

You obviously have not been a victim of a home invasion/murder attempt.
You obviously don't care about your own property or safety.
Other folks DO care.
America is not Europe, nor should it be.
You folks pass all the laws you like.

Many Americans do not live in 600 sq ft apartments on top of one another like the average Brit.
Many live in rural areas and can't depend on Bobbies or whatever.

Pernicious

2010-01-14 03:10:50

lead wrote:
Pernicious wrote:Its a known fact that allowing citezens to own guns does not increase gun crime.
are you fucking serious man? easy access to knives is one of the reasons glasgow is the murder capital for knife crime...if guns were easier to access it would be a fuckin bloodbath!
Uh, i am talking normal citizens here, not criminals, wat hapens wen guns are legal is, only ppl without a criminal record, over the age of 18/21 (not sure but 21 would be best) who have registered and had background checks etc etc, can purchase weapons for the home, and must be kept in a safe. And yes, if used incorrectly they should, and will be punished.

Knives, punks use knives, cheap, easy to get a hold of. U cant stop ppl getting knives, everybody needs knives. Guns, are expensive.

provost

2010-01-14 03:36:59

I'm pretty sure that if all the money and effort they invest with desiging new law projects, advertisement around guns (for or agaisnt) would instead serve to reduce education fees or healthcare, wich are two massive and crucial source of outcome for an individual or a family...well.... healthier/richer/more educated people = less robbery

And yes, it's so easy to find illegal guns (or pretty much anything illegal) that all these laws simply end up being a fuckload of annoyment for legit citizens.

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 04:24:04

That is so true. Most things the Left is concerned about is really none of their fucking business.
Health care policies, Credit Card rules, Cell Phones, What you eat, salaries and bonuses, profits that health insurers make... All NONE OF THEIR FUCKING BUSINESS!

I'm sick of this nanny bullshit from idiot politicians who know jack shit about anything.
The portion of Health care that is in trouble is the fricking PUBLIC OPTION we already have!
So, reform that shit!??!
What is this retool the entire health economy.

Also, America has the finest AND most expensive health care.
Its like expecting a Beemer for Ciivc money.

Whether folks have guns, its in the fucking Constitution!
None of their business.

I swear to GOD, if you let these geniuses care, they WILL. They will worm their way into every aspect of our lives, thinking for us, doing for us.
Hell, instead of dominating the world in new patents, invention, technology, we;ll become France!

Why are so many Lefties playing a Gun oriented MURDER game anyways!??!?
WTF?

Sacrifist

2010-01-14 06:30:50

The Argumentalizer wrote: I swear to GOD, if you let these geniuses care, they WILL. They will worm their way into every aspect of our lives, thinking for us, doing for us.
Hell, instead of dominating the world in new patents, invention, technology, we;ll become France!
Top 25 countries based on standard of living

1. France

2. Australia

3. Switzerland

4. Germany

5. New Zealand

6. Luxembourg

7. United States

8. Belgium

9. Canada

10. Italy

11. Netherlands

12. Norway

13. Austria

14. Liechtenstein

15. Malta

16. Denmark

17. Spain

18. Finland

19. Uruguay

20. Hungary

21. Portugal

22. Lithuania

23. Andorra

24. Czech Republic

25. United Kingdom


You were saying???

Ko-Tao

2010-01-14 07:44:38

"Standard of Living" is such an abstract term, and so heavily subject to personal opinion, that such charts are a small step away from worthless.

Fearsome*

2010-01-14 08:36:53

I try to look at things without bias as much as possible. I have looked into gun owner ship and this is what I have found.

It simply does not matter. Guns or no guns there is no significant evidence that either way is safer overall. Everyone on both sides likes to tell very touching stories to support their points but in a sense neither is right or wrong and stories are meaningless anyone anywhere can come up with a story to support their claim, which might be true or a lie. Switzerland is a country where guns used to be MANDATORY pretty much everyone had to have one because everyone had to be in the army. They have a very low crime rate. England is the opposite no guns allowed and also a low crime rate, both are developed nations. The US has guns but has a higher crime rate but nothing as bad as Brazil which does not allow guns. The fact is the things that effect crime rate really have nothing to do with guns, they have to do with how dense the population is and poverty. That is all if you want to solve the problem mainly you must solve poverty.

If you start to think about it you can go in circles with every argument.

Add guns, some criminals are scared to rob people or murder because they being cowards may actually confront someone with weapons. But then other criminals become worse because they know that other people have guns so when they rob they shoot first check for a gun later. If people have guns they can take down postal people, but then cops cannot arrest people who have guns. People with guns can run off and do something stupid fast like kill their cheating wife, then again what stops you from hacking her with a knife, pencil or your bare hands. The problem I am illustrating is that humans are far to intelligent to just sit there and not adapt, what ever the rules are guns or no guns some people will figure out a way around it, or better yet use the rule to their advantage. Like all things of great power it is all about the person using the power. The one nice thing about guns is they are an equalizer it does not matter how strong you are if you are willing to pull trigger it is the same with nuclear weapons a small country can now defend itself against anyone because few are willing to risk taking a hit from a gun or a nuclear weapon. The threat of mutual destruction ensures peace they say.

I really don't care most of the time because in reality if you live in a nice area you probably wont bother to have a gun anyway. If you live in a bad area you might pick one up even if you are law abiding citizen and it is not allowed.

ninojman

2010-01-14 08:39:38

If you pay 42% of your wages in taxes I would hope so.

As far as guns go, ever wonder why cops don't get mugged that much?

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 09:42:03

Standard of living!??! Where did you get that crap, the UN!?!?

Everyone in the world knows who has the best standard of living, the US.
I wonder, have some Americans here ever actually lived there?
I remember German girls bitching about their grandmothers health care and a 3 tier system that screws the old and poor.
I lived in Germany, where most folks live in a tiny home or apartment.
The average Euro lives in a 600 to 800 square foot apartment.
Most don't even own a car.
They wait and wait for medical.
Unemployment in the 18 25 range is 40%.
Moslems are burning up cars.
Folks in France went on vacation and 10'000 senoirs DIED because of the summer heat.
Most folks in Europe will never have the opportunity to own a business.
School is highly stratified.

Standard of living my ass.
Speaking of equalizers, if i was a woman, id be packing heat, maybe a nice 380.

If you see the American flags flying in a neighborhood, you'd better go do crime elsewhere.
I know neighborhoods, even towns, in the country, where, you wouldn't dare break into folks homes.
Their neighbor will shoot you.
And the State and local Gubbmint wouldn't blink an eye.
Break into my home. I will shoot you dead. Probably without warning.
Wanna try?

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 09:58:44

Let me remind folks: even with America's problem, we are not in serious decline like Europe.
A majority of EU countries don't even fornicate and produce children to replenish their populations.
Growth and unemployment are still higher in the US except Germany, notwithstanding this recession, caused by Gubbmint policy.

Britain, once a great power and an awesome spreader of civilization, is now irrelevant.
Most EU countries are on the verge of economic collapse, depending on ever higher taxes to feed Gubbmint.
Euros like to pride themselves on their easier "more civilized" nuanced approach while they KNOW something is deeply wrong.

I'd also like to mention that comparing the US to any Euro country is silly.
The US compares to the entire continent of Europe, not France.
Our 50 states have more economic output than the entire European Continent or EU, if you like.

In what sense is the US richer?

"Average gross domestic product (GDP) in the US is about 40% higher than average GDP of the EU-15 when measured at purchasing power parity (PPP). The gap is slightly greater if we consider either the twelve Eurozone members (EU-12) or add the accession states (EU-25). Although GDP is a poor indicator of measure of welfare or happiness, let’s agree to use it for the sake of comparison."

"Now while it is true that the US has a better employment and unemployment record, the key to understanding the difference between the EU and the US lies in disaggregating employment by age group. If we compare employment rates in 2005 of the 25-55 age group, there is virtually no difference; e.g., the employment rates are 86 and 88 percent for the EU-15 and the US respectively (ignoring differences in how the data are recorded). The US data show a higher employment rate for youth (15-24) and a much higher rate for preretirement (55-64) and post retirement (65 and over) groups. What the average employment and unemployment figures hide is the agespecific nature of the ‘European problem’. The picture remains much the same when comparing the US and the EU-25."

"France (211,000 square miles) is between Texas (269,000 square miles) and California (164,000 square miles) in size. Austria (32,000 square miles) has almost exactly the same area as Maine."

When folks talk about an American President, they should remember there is no equivalent in Europe.
There would have to be ONE leader and a Congress for the entire EU 25 to even come close!

The significant difference between the United States and many European countries - as well as Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan - is the birth rate. Women in the U.S. average about 2.1 children, while in Europe overall, the figure is about 1.5.

Va|iums

2010-01-14 10:19:42

Fearsome* wrote:I try to look at things without bias as much as possible. I have looked into gun owner ship and this is what I have found.

It simply does not matter. Guns or no guns there is no significant evidence that either way is safer overall. Everyone on both sides likes to tell very touching stories to support their points but in a sense neither is right or wrong and stories are meaningless anyone anywhere can come up with a story to support their claim, which might be true or a lie.

If you start to think about it you can go in circles with every argument.
This ^^ In academia and philosophy one begins to learn for every arguement there is usually a valid counterarguement. However one must take a stand in what one believes in. After doing some pretty intensive research myself for a paper where I was forced to be pro-gun, both within the United States from state to state and GLOBALLY there exists a vast contradiction in whether lax gun laws decrease crime or increase it, simply from state to state within the US or with international countries the factual statistics are perplexing and result in no ability to factually state in a general statement that GUNS DECREASE CRIME, OR GUNS INCREASE CRIME. Fearsome is correct in correlating poverty with gun crime, this is a factual trend throughout the world, and has been for decades, long enough to say it is a fact poverty correlates to gun crime, no matter the country or state.

All that said my stand is the right to bear arms must be maintained to prevent tyranny of the government, directly implied in the U.S. Constitution to a point of irrefutable strict judicial review, beyond the power of president or the Court's jurisdiction to completely abolish and I too will stand by it. Grey areas of what types of firearms, the transportation of firearms beyond country and state lines and the requirements of purchasing a firearms however are not cut and dry for me, nor should they be with anyone.

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 10:25:06

Goddamn! That is sensible. And here i thought...

My God, that is a strong Constitutional/Founding judgment/attitude if i have ever heard one.
Bravo Valiums

Va|iums

2010-01-14 10:33:31

The Argumentalizer wrote:Goddamn! That is sensible. And here i thought...

My God, that is a strong Constitutional/Founding judgment/attitude if i have ever heard one.
Bravo Valiums
You'd be surprised how conservative I am compared to many of my family and academic peers. I tested out as a centrist leaning slight left, many of the issues I center on I won't go into ;). One thing I won't fuck with if I become a politician is the U.S. Constitution, after a few classes of it you have a grand and awe inspiring respect for it. Obama taught U.S. Constitutional law at the University of Chicago, you best believe he too has the same grand respect and hesistation to push its limits as I do, have you seen him try to push for stricter gun laws yet? Nope, and he won't for the remainder of his presidency, bank on it.

lead

2010-01-14 11:53:38

The Argumentalizer wrote:Let me remind folks: even with America's problem, we are not in serious decline like Europe.
A majority of EU countries don't even fornicate and produce children to replenish their populations.
Growth and unemployment are still higher in the US except Germany, notwithstanding this recession, caused by Gubbmint policy.

Britain, once a great power and an awesome spreader of civilization, is now irrelevant.
Most EU countries are on the verge of economic collapse, depending on ever higher taxes to feed Gubbmint.
Euros like to pride themselves on their easier "more civilized" nuanced approach while they KNOW something is deeply wrong.

I'd also like to mention that comparing the US to any Euro country is silly.
The US compares to the entire continent of Europe, not France.
Our 50 states have more economic output than the entire European Continent or EU, if you like.

In what sense is the US richer?

"Average gross domestic product (GDP) in the US is about 40% higher than average GDP of the EU-15 when measured at purchasing power parity (PPP). The gap is slightly greater if we consider either the twelve Eurozone members (EU-12) or add the accession states (EU-25). Although GDP is a poor indicator of measure of welfare or happiness, let’s agree to use it for the sake of comparison."

"Now while it is true that the US has a better employment and unemployment record, the key to understanding the difference between the EU and the US lies in disaggregating employment by age group. If we compare employment rates in 2005 of the 25-55 age group, there is virtually no difference; e.g., the employment rates are 86 and 88 percent for the EU-15 and the US respectively (ignoring differences in how the data are recorded). The US data show a higher employment rate for youth (15-24) and a much higher rate for preretirement (55-64) and post retirement (65 and over) groups. What the average employment and unemployment figures hide is the agespecific nature of the ‘European problem’. The picture remains much the same when comparing the US and the EU-25."

"France (211,000 square miles) is between Texas (269,000 square miles) and California (164,000 square miles) in size. Austria (32,000 square miles) has almost exactly the same area as Maine."

When folks talk about an American President, they should remember there is no equivalent in Europe.
There would have to be ONE leader and a Congress for the entire EU 25 to even come close!

The significant difference between the United States and many European countries - as well as Japan, South Korea, and Taiwan - is the birth rate. Women in the U.S. average about 2.1 children, while in Europe overall, the figure is about 1.5.
god you are a complete fanny aren't you? (p.s. fanny = vagina in case you can't quite work it out in your silly wee head)

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 12:21:36

I bet your kilted Scottish ass has never set foot in America.
But i have been there!
And i lived in Germany.

God you are a complete fanny.
What a powerful douchebag nothing of an argument.

koncentrate

2010-01-14 12:37:43

lol US made G.W. Bush for president TWICE, thats the main thing coming to my mind when i think about us :lol:

Pernicious

2010-01-14 12:55:44

Fearsome* wrote:I try to look at things without bias as much as possible. I have looked into gun owner ship and this is what I have found.

It simply does not matter. Guns or no guns there is no significant evidence that either way is safer overall. Everyone on both sides likes to tell very touching stories to support their points but in a sense neither is right or wrong and stories are meaningless anyone anywhere can come up with a story to support their claim, which might be true or a lie. Switzerland is a country where guns used to be MANDATORY pretty much everyone had to have one because everyone had to be in the army. They have a very low crime rate. England is the opposite no guns allowed and also a low crime rate, both are developed nations. The US has guns but has a higher crime rate but nothing as bad as Brazil which does not allow guns. The fact is the things that effect crime rate really have nothing to do with guns, they have to do with how dense the population is and poverty. That is all if you want to solve the problem mainly you must solve poverty.

If you start to think about it you can go in circles with every argument.

Add guns, some criminals are scared to rob people or murder because they being cowards may actually confront someone with weapons. But then other criminals become worse because they know that other people have guns so when they rob they shoot first check for a gun later. If people have guns they can take down postal people, but then cops cannot arrest people who have guns. People with guns can run off and do something stupid fast like kill their cheating wife, then again what stops you from hacking her with a knife, pencil or your bare hands. The problem I am illustrating is that humans are far to intelligent to just sit there and not adapt, what ever the rules are guns or no guns some people will figure out a way around it, or better yet use the rule to their advantage. Like all things of great power it is all about the person using the power. The one nice thing about guns is they are an equalizer it does not matter how strong you are if you are willing to pull trigger it is the same with nuclear weapons a small country can now defend itself against anyone because few are willing to risk taking a hit from a gun or a nuclear weapon. The threat of mutual destruction ensures peace they say.

I really don't care most of the time because in reality if you live in a nice area you probably wont bother to have a gun anyway. If you live in a bad area you might pick one up even if you are law abiding citizen and it is not allowed.
Yes.
And after all that, the innocent should still have the right to protect themselves against bodily harm from the ..not so innocent )=^B.

Sacrifist

2010-01-14 15:53:12

koncentrate wrote:lol US made G.W. Bush for president TWICE, thats the main thing coming to my mind when i think about us :lol:
I'm not sure the US really voted him in either time lol. Gore had more votes and that entire election is a wash. That being said, I voted for Bush the first time around. When you are basically stuck with voting for 1 of 2 people, I try to choose the lesser of 2 evils. Gore and Kerry were both, and are still both, just as retarded as Bush. McCain is probably worse then all 3. I really dont think the American people have made any mistakes other then allowing their elected officials to get away with so much crap for so long. The congress is where the real problems are.

lead

2010-01-14 17:04:10

The Argumentalizer wrote:I bet your kilted Scottish ass has never set foot in America.-WRONG
But i have been there!_WELL YOU STAY THERE
And i lived in Germany.-POINT?

God you are a complete fanny. YEP YOU ARE
What a powerful douchebag nothing of an argument._STATEMENT NOT ARGUMENT
Go **** yourself Scotty.-I WISH I COULD
Bring something or stay home, homo-SAPIEN? CORRECT ON THAT ONE

"god you are a complete fanny aren't you? (p.s. fanny = vagina in case you can't quite work it out in your silly wee head)"

What a completely lame and childish bit of nonsense.-BEACON OF INTELLECTUAL KNOWLEDGE ARENT YOU
Why didn't you just call me a FART or something.'-FREE SPEECH CHECK YOUR CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS
Euro-Fags.-EURO CIGARETTES? DONT SMOKE THANKS
I ****ing can't stand their smug liberal/socialist asses-WHAT ABOUT CONSERVATIVE ASSES DONT THEY GET A MENTION OR DIDNT YOU KNOW ABOUT THEM
Talk about ignorant!'-FUCKS SAKE :lol:
Douchebag.-HANDBAG
You have state owned socialist media!GOD I LOVE AUNTIE BEEB EVEN THOUGH SHE HAS HAD COMMERCIAL COMPETITION SINCE 1955
**** you.-NOT WITH YOUR WEE KNOB

And NO YOU IDIOT FANNY means BEHIND, where your ass is.
-WELL I UNDERSTAND NOW, YOU ARE VERY BEHIND IN YOUR COUNTRY BUT YOUR STILL A FANNY IN MINE

well done for reinforcing my previous point about you! gg

Shoobie

2010-01-14 18:04:34

Well if everyone shoots a visitor a year and says he's a robber. You'll open up for more jobs, less potential future robbers, someones pain in the but probably will dissapear.

Well you should invite some poor fuck though, one of these guys taht can't afford health care as they would die anyway if they'd get hit by something serious. So this way you'll just get rid of 'em earlier.

Also how good does it really work if you have to be afraid of your government, "Omfg everyone must arm themselves. There might be a tyranny going on." You can arm yourselves all you want. If your government wanna kill you all I don't think that would be a problem. You might actually be on their property. So if they kill you all it doesn't really matter.

There's this old grandmother, she's coming from a poor family. They couldn't pay for her to get any help. They have to take care of her by themselves. The old grandmother has alzheimers, she lives in Argumentalizers neigbourhood. On day in the middle of the night this old woman wakes up, she can't sleep. She decide to take a walk outside, the poor lady then looses her way. She ends up infront of Argumentalizers house. As she have this disease she thinks it's her house. She goes in as this one time Argumentalizer have forgot to lock tghe door. She finds her way into the kitchen. Opens the fridge. This is when argumentalizer hears her. He pick up his shotgun and sneak his way to the kitchen. In the darkness he just see a figure in his house. Argumentalizer fills up with rage. Just one thought goes thorugh his head. "There's some fucker invading my castle, Imma go medieval on his ass!". He aims carefully and shoots, he blows the womans brains out. GG argumentalizer. But who cares? She was invading your property.

keefy

2010-01-14 18:10:00

The Argumentalizer wrote:I bet your kilted Scottish ass has never set foot in America.
But i have been there!
And i lived in Germany.

God you are a complete fanny.
What a powerful douchebag nothing of an argument.
Go **** yourself Scotty.
Bring something or stay home, homo

"god you are a complete fanny aren't you? (p.s. fanny = vagina in case you can't quite work it out in your silly wee head)"

What a completely lame and childish bit of nonsense.
Why didn't you just call me a FART or something.
Euro-Fags.
I ****ing can't stand their smug liberal/socialist asses.
Talk about ignorant!
Douchebag.
You have state owned socialist media!
**** you.

And NO YOU IDIOT FANNY means BEHIND, where your ass is.
So What!

CellarDweller

2010-01-14 19:54:20

Shoobie wrote:Well if everyone shoots a visitor a year and says he's a robber. You'll open up for more jobs, less potential future robbers, someones pain in the but probably will dissapear.

Well you should invite some poor fuck though, one of these guys taht can't afford health care as they would die anyway if they'd get hit by something serious. So this way you'll just get rid of 'em earlier.

Also how good does it really work if you have to be afraid of your government, "Omfg everyone must arm themselves. There might be a tyranny going on." You can arm yourselves all you want. If your government wanna kill you all I don't think that would be a problem. You might actually be on their property. So if they kill you all it doesn't really matter.

There's this old grandmother, she's coming from a poor family. They couldn't pay for her to get any help. They have to take care of her by themselves. The old grandmother has alzheimers, she lives in Argumentalizers neigbourhood. On day in the middle of the night this old woman wakes up, she can't sleep. She decide to take a walk outside, the poor lady then looses her way. She ends up infront of Argumentalizers house. As she have this disease she thinks it's her house. She goes in as this one time Argumentalizer have forgot to lock tghe door. She finds her way into the kitchen. Opens the fridge. This is when argumentalizer hears her. He pick up his shotgun and sneak his way to the kitchen. In the darkness he just see a figure in his house. Argumentalizer fills up with rage. Just one thought goes thorugh his head. "There's some fucker invading my castle, Imma go medieval on his ass!". He aims carefully and shoots, he blows the womans brains out. GG argumentalizer. But who cares? She was invading your property.
britain lost its common law, sweden lost its common sense.

try this on:

a man knocks on your door at bedtime stating he needs help. as you open the door, he forces his way in at gunpoint. he has an accomplice. they round up your 4 other friends make you all strip naked.

they ask for your money. you all cooperate. offer up every bit of spare change you have, jewelery, anything of value.

your female friends are forced to perform oral sex with each other. the males are then forced to have intercourse with the females. when you fail to get an erection, you are beaten with a golf club.

one burglar leaves with a victim to get money from an atm. the other remains and rapes your female friend. each victim in turn, being driven to drain their atm account. each female in turn raped, repeatedly as the night continued. all victims continuing to cooperate, hoping their lives would be spared.

eventually, you and your friends are crammed into the trunk of a car, still naked. you are driven to a snow covered soccer field, released from the trunk, and ordered to kneel in the snow.

one by one, you and your friends are shot in the back of the head. left lying naked on the snow, bleeding, dying. then, for good measure, the burglars run over your bodies with a truck.

miraculously, one of your friends survives. after the burglars drive away, she checks on her friends. she can do little to help them. so she runs a mile in the frigid cold, naked, bleeding, dodging any vehicles out of fear that it may be the burglars again.

until finally, she finds a house and knocks on the door, and get s the help she needs.

meanwhile, the burglars return to your house to steal some more shit... and stab your dog to death.

:x

true story. not a fantasy about a confused, elderly woman getting shot for letting herself into a neighbors house and making a pbj sammich.

now, what fear and val said may be accurate, but the above reality was a game changer for me regarding views on gun ownership and burglars.

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-14 20:24:43

Lead "-WELL I UNDERSTAND NOW, YOU ARE VERY BEHIND IN YOUR COUNTRY BUT YOUR STILL A FANNY IN MINE

well done for reinforcing my previous point about you! gg"

Wow, awesome comeback.

More "You are a Farthead".
What a genius argument.

Scotland IS the ARSE of England. The very asshole of a Great Empire.

SND

2010-01-14 20:45:24

cell I fail to see how having a gun on your property and having the right to shot anyone on it would prevent that. If they surprise you and plan in advanced you won't get a chance to run get a gun and shot the fool before he shoots you. But yea your right in a away in terms US because guns are already out the government would have a hard time taking all the guns while in the mean while citizens that follow the law would suffer since those who don't follow the law would use it to their advantage.

Thing is since there not much guns around where I am their is no need for me or my family owning a gun because simply the likely hood of any of us to coming across someone one with a gun is pretty slim.

But yes I do agree I should have the right to protect my property and my self and yea the law here is a bit F up in this regard since police expect you not to do nothing while someone on your property stealing shit. But that's k nothing is stopping me from clobbering the guy with a bat and might as well deal with the consequences latter but I don't need a gun to protect my property.

Plus this bashing between US and Euro is stupid we all got problems where we are and I don't see how making it out it worse somewhere else sorts out the problem where you are.

lead

2010-01-14 21:20:56

The Argumentalizer wrote:Lead "-WELL I UNDERSTAND NOW, YOU ARE VERY BEHIND IN YOUR COUNTRY BUT YOUR STILL A FANNY IN MINE

well done for reinforcing my previous point about you! gg"

Wow, awesome comeback.

More "You are a Farthead".
What a genius argument.

Scotland IS the ARSE of England. The very asshole of a Great Empire.
thanks it was concise I thought and factually accurate. :rofl:

CellarDweller

2010-01-14 21:32:16

SND wrote:cell I fail to see how having a gun on your property and having the right to shot anyone on it would prevent that. If they surprise you and plan in advanced you won't get a chance to run get a gun and shot the fool before he shoots you.
possible. just as possible it could have made difference in the outcome.

in this case, one bad guy repeatedly left the house with one of the victims to drain their atm, leaving one bad guy in the house with 3 males and 1 female, or 2 males and 2 females. while he was raping the female, the others were SHUT in a closet in another room. not LOCKED in a closet. SHUT, and unsupervised. they were being cooperative and didnt even try to escape. IF there was a gun in that room, it could have made a difference.

the lone survivor talked about how easily she could have reached the bad guys gun while he was raping her. but she was resigned to submit to any humility and degradation to survive. she said she was AFRAID to grab the gun because she was unfamiliar with guns. she was more AFRAID of a handgun, than the man raping her.

is that the result of the anti-gun mindset? dunno.

Shoobie

2010-01-14 23:54:22

My story wasn't serious for one bit. All I wanted to get through is that killing should be a last result not some thing you do just because you're allowed protect yourself.

If I look at Sweden I can't really come up with any burglary that have ended up in a murderer. People can't get guns really. A hunting rifle at the most. those who have guns arn't a simple burglar you need to go deeper down in the shit than that if you need guns. Therefore a normal person don't have to fear taht there's a burglar coming in with a gun. I'd rather say that a normal person don't even have to be afraid of a burglar at all. Maybe when you're on vacation but not when you're home. Really I'm not the one to say if you guys should ahve a gun or not. I dunno how safe you feel in your country. All I would know is that I would feel less safe if everyone had a gun than now when no one has one.

I just think about the small kids that find their dad's gun and then shoot people at their schools.

this wouldn't stop me to knock him out with a bat as SND said if I was able to or even shoot him in the leg if i had a gun. What my sarcastic statement came form was the simple fact that for you it doesn't matter if you kill someone or not. Just fucking shoot em. Without hesitation. I'm pretty sure the normal burglar don't come to kill you. But what do I know.

ether

2010-01-15 00:21:27

Having a gun is not enough. Training with it enough so that the movements are instinctual and can be performed under high stress is just as important. So is situational awareness. Opening the door to two strange men is just not smart these days, but I understand why someone would do it in a reasonably safe neighborhood. When I look at the US economy, I see many things that are unsustainable. I see hard times ahead and social unrest that could range from moderate to severe depending on how things play out. I think this will start to become obvious by the end of 2010. The US govt has $2 trillion in debt to rollover this year, plus new deficits. It seems unlikely that foreigners will continue to service our debt at the levels seen in recent years. What will likely happen is that the Fed will monetize the debt, leading to higher inflation, and higher interest rates. Once interest rates rise, the financial system will implode, and I don't think implode is too strong a word. If there was ever a time to review your home security system, including owning firearms, it's now. It may not save you, but it might. You may still die in a car wreck if you're wearing a seat belt, but that doesn't mean it's useless to wear your seat belt.

CellarDweller

2010-01-15 00:33:11

i can't speak for the laws in britain or sweden...

but here, if you assault someone with a baseball bat, the bat becomes legally defined as a lethal weapon and you can be charged with armed criminal action if serious injury or death results. same charges as if you used a gun, knife, crowbar, golfclub, screwdriver, etc. its the manner in which the item was used.

if you're defending yourself/others in your own home, it becomes justifiable homocide if you kill the person. same as with a gun.

if you dont have reasonable fear for your/others life and safety, you can be charged with assault AND sued for excessive use of force.

maybe i came across as flippant. if you're in reasonable fear for your/others life and safety in your own home... here in the states... you are justified in using lethal force. i'm under no legal obligation to negotiate, mitigate, retreat, etc. i want that lethal force to be IMMEDIATE!

ether

2010-01-15 00:43:38

The exact laws vary by state. IMO, if someone has broken into your house, particularly at night, you should have the right to use deadly force. Why should the home owner have to give the advantage to the intruder? Do you stop to chit chat with someone who may blow you away at any moment? Every "courtesy" I extend to the intruder adds to the risk to my family. Why is the onus on me? If you don't want to get shot, don't break into people's houses. It's as simple as that.

The Argumentalizer

2010-01-15 00:59:34

If they break into your house, they are up to no good. Shoot them, club them, w/e. Just finish the job so they don't sue you directly.
And tell the police you feared for your life.
And if you shoot them in the back, make sure you tell them it was too dark to tell he was turning around.

Kill that criminal **** and do the world a favor.

Nutz

2010-01-15 01:04:51

The Argumentalizer wrote:If they break into your house, they are up to no good. Shoot them, club them, w/e. Just finish the job so they don't sue you directly.
And tell the police you feared for your life.
And if you shoot them in the back, make sure you tell them it was too dark to tell he was turning around.

Kill that criminal **** and do the world a favor.


"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." -- George Washington

Constipator

2010-01-15 04:27:33

I didn't understand the idea of just letting people take your shit so your insurance can just pay you back for it. Anyone who thinks that is what happens is fucking ignorant. If you're broken into the only outcome that you win in is really if you stop them and then not get convicted for it.

At our house, our insurance company depreciates the value of our property. So, if we get shit stolen we lose money, cause we don't get what we paid for it in the first place AND our insurance rate goes up! THEN, if we were to get broken into over & over again and keep putting claims in, our insurance company can cancel our insurance for being too high of a risk to insure!

You can pay a higher rate for insurance that repays you 100% value of stolen property, but that's just it, it's mooooore expensive! People are having a hard enough time right now just being able to afford insurance, so they definitely aren't gonna be able to afford the best coverage. A gun + a box or 2 of ammo is a cheap, one-time-payment type of VERY dependable insurance.

Not to mention that someone breaking into the house is a threat to your life with or without a gun cause they could just as easily make a weapon outta something laying around your house. The impossibility of knowing someone's true intentions and inhibitions is good enough cause for me to feel that my life is threatened, especially if it's night time.

You can rest assured, I WILL have a gun whether or not the law allows it here, nor will I be uneducated on its use or afraid to use it when necessary.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-15 05:34:28

God, the Metroid games were so fucking fun.

Except Prime 2, that shit was just a fucking chore.




...




oh ya, and criminals suck and all that that BS, k, ya.

Constipator

2010-01-15 07:46:05

NOTnewguy wrote:God, the Metroid games were so fucking fun.

Except Prime 2, that shit was just a fucking chore.
Do you include Prime 3 in the fun category? I do, loved that shit.

old time no.7

2010-01-15 16:51:00

guns are fucking awesome. they're real dangerous tools in too many wrong hands these days. but i grew up with a gun in my house, my dad had shotguns and a pistol. he had a gun safe and the bullets/shells locked up. i've been deer hunting, skeet shooting and have only once been to a real indoor range and a few outdoor ranges. the shit is fucking fun. i don't care you can't talk shit until you pull the trigger on one. i kinda think the simpsons writers nailed it with the sense of overinflated ego stroking. but firing off a few rounds at a paper target, moving target and live game is a thrill i almost try to replicate in the comfort of my home in a video game fps.

i don't know about your average civy owning automatic weapons though, but hey shotguns and pistols for use of home protection are ok with me. i was actually looking at NJ NRA, the dues are a bit much so i think i'll get a permit for a pistol, they fuck you in NJ for the dual application of long gun/pistol license. but shit jersey just made medical mj ok so i'm laughing pretty hard at our governments dualities right now.

i'm looking at a glock 19 or sig sauer or a usp. any thoughts opinions out there? i'm looking for something easy to field strip and clean like the glock.

n3cr0tos1n

2010-01-15 19:35:59

I wrote a paper on the second amendment. This guy clearly did the right thing, lucky for him though he isn't dead.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-15 19:47:16

Constipator wrote:
NOTnewguy wrote:God, the Metroid games were so fucking fun.

Except Prime 2, that shit was just a fucking chore.
Do you include Prime 3 in the fun category? I do, loved that shit.

Of course.
That game made the prime trilogy worthwhile, and this chick who fancies herself my girlfriend got me the trilogy game-set thing.
I didn't tell her I already had all three, but the wiimakes are fucking good; they even added bloom lighting to the first two and made the third prime have full-on HDR lighting.
Load times are a bit longer in the third one now though, but it is worth it.

The fact that Retro Studios can make a game look that good with last-gen hardware means they should get a fucking medal.

Oh, and to everyone else : this is now a Metriod Thread, either get with it or GTFO.

No one would even use a gun if we all had powered armorsuits...........................and boobs.




EDIT: I am pretty sure she got it when it was on sale at best buy for 20$; it is worth it at that price but not at 50$ which is what I have seen it at as of late.
If you haven't played Prime 2, don't :: p1 and p3 are fucking awesome though.

Ko-Tao

2010-01-15 22:52:52

Super Metroid was the best of the metroids, just as SOTN was the best castlevania.

Its with good reason that the two combined spawned their own genre.

provost

2010-01-15 23:19:31

damn straight, i'd love to see a super metroid HD remix

keefy

2010-01-16 04:46:06

I missed out on Nintendo, we were poor :(

provost

2010-01-16 04:52:58

Gotta emulate 'em all

NOTnewguy

2010-01-16 06:45:48

Ko-Tao wrote:Super Metroid was the best of the metroids, just as SOTN was the best castlevania.

Its with good reason that the two combined spawned their own genre.
Would that be a 'platform adventure?'
I never really payed attention as to what category it was placed under.

NOTnewguy

2010-01-16 06:54:12

provost wrote:damn straight, i'd love to see a super metroid HD remix
Let's just call it Metroid 3, but you are absolutely right.
With modern rendering abilities, imagine how fucking scary the wrecked ship could be, or how fucking immersive Brinstarr could be.

I get so hard just thinking about it. Not big or anything. Just hard. Yah.

Ko-Tao

2010-01-16 09:03:48

NOTnewguy wrote:
Ko-Tao wrote:Super Metroid was the best of the metroids, just as SOTN was the best castlevania.

Its with good reason that the two combined spawned their own genre.
Would that be a 'platform adventure?'
I never really payed attention as to what category it was placed under.
Games emulating that style are commonly referred to as "metroidvanias".

And ya, an hd remake of super metroid (or castlevania sotn, or preferably both) would be the bomb.

REJECTED

2010-01-16 09:41:18

This thread is now about Metroid.

Also, if you like metal and Metroid music, check out: http://www.metroidmetal.com

Sacrifist

2010-01-17 21:16:58

I've never understood why nintendo didn't take all it's main characters from something like bash brothers and create a pc game that was an all out fps lol. The possibilities would be endless haha.

Fearsome*

2010-01-19 03:17:51

Sacrifist wrote:I've never understood why nintendo didn't take all it's main characters from something like bash brothers and create a pc game that was an all out fps lol. The possibilities would be endless haha.

Maybe because they are they are nintendo and they make consoles not PC games.