critique dm_swamplight_final

Is this map worth updating? Is it worth keeping? What would you change?

i love the map but even if it was fixed up a bit it wouldnt play well still

What makes it play or not play well be specific, do not be ambiguous. It's not possible to work on maps when people say things like it does not have good flow or it does not play well. You have to pick apart what exactly is playing well, what exactly is good flow and how does a map not achieve it.

What if the team spawns were removed and players just respawned randomly everywhere? What if the mines were removed?

IMHO such elaborate maps as swamplight have passed away. the only stock map which suvived and is still scrimed is LD and that is because its fast and instantaneous.
a map can be big and yet maintain pace. swamplight cannot. That's what i think.

The other stock maps arent played as much because most of them just plain SUCK! Swamplight on the other hand is a nice map and IMO fun to play. It is one of my favorites. Try playing a CAL match on it, yea its not as fast paced as Zeta or LD, but its a lot of fun and there definately is a stratgey to it. I would say yes it is worth an update.

The first thing that comes to mind is yes, random spawns would definatly be a better option. Id have to run through the map again and check out the FPS, but if would benefit to reoptimize to increase performance then that would be a good idea also. There really arent that many slams so I dont think they detract from it, but I dont think it matters if they are there or not. In general I am not crazy about them.

If I think of anything else Ill let you know.

Swamplight is not a stock map

Stock maps are dm_lockdown, dm_overwatch, dm_powerhouse, dm_underpass, dm_resistance

Nothing else is a stock map all others are community made maps.

I was aware that Swamp is a custom map, maybe Valar didnt know tho?

One whole end of Swamplight is superfluous.
The rooms on the right side looking from the RPG, with the AR2, sawblades and charger and the shotty are wasted space and slow the map down. Why is the AR2 there? A mag should be there.
The shotty room is just fodder for the RPG, so nothing ever happens in there. The catwalk is good for what? With a raging battle for RPG, what are you going to do up there?
Yes the room behind it has another access to main room, but there is already one below near it.
A small window to snipe at the RPG would be cool.

The weapons lay out has always seemed odd.

that little Culde sac with the Pickup?!?!?!

There is a strong RPG and a strong side that is defensible and one that is weak. Even to use the right side means getting weapons a good distance away.
Rebels blend in too much in the darker Swamp area.

The recessed courtyard outside is annoying.
The flow through most of the map is pretty good.

Having said all that, Swamplight is killer

i didnt say swamplight was stock map. i made a point using stock map as reference.

burn it

You got any?

Turn all the team spawns into deathmatch spawns, remove the slams, add useful pickups to the most dangerous areas of the map, rework all the dead ends to flow smoothly (add lifts / bouncers / ladders / stairs / new passages; whatever does the best job of increasing flow), move all those pickups that are crammed into nooks and crannies out into the map, clip off the few prop-jumpable camp spots outside, reduce sawblade count to 1.

I probably missed a few things, but thats a good start.

Only time I played it for real was in the draftnight.... but before that I just played it on pubs and used to hate it.
why? main reason was my pc wasn't high end, and the outside part gave me ridiculously bad fps... and the outside part, having the rpg, is a place that you WILL have to go to.
I'm sorry I can't really provide much info about the map, since I haven't played it enough, but I did like the draft night match we played there as far as I recall.
All I can say taking into accout my few games there, is try improving the fps on the outside area.... I'm aware this isn't the best response... but I don't have much experience on it.

yea i think the water should be taken out for being able to run on pc's purposes. i think that the map is a fairly fluent (so you can't b-hop one time to get through the whole map.....so what?), it is a Cal map that has a different type of gameplay to it. most maps are thrown out because the majority want a replica of others maps just with a different layout. my opinion for it...

has anyone ever tryed to do a match without the team spawns on. it might be a little crazy, but it could be fun. i dont know if it will be better, but we could try...don't just say it sux, i want ld. give it a try...

stretch

Well put Stretch.

I don't think anyone has tried to take the team spawn out yet because that might be construed as messing with someone elses map so unless Fearsome has talked to the map maker and got permission to do it, then most likely it hasn't been tried.

replace with icepick.

Ice pick is a good map too, but it has the same team spawn issue that Swamp has.
Go figure...same map maker.

that would be cool, i dont think i have ever seen a match on icepick. but yea with teamspawns, unless each side has the same weapons, then it just does not work...or please everyone...

stretch

Fearsome* wrote:Is this map worth updating? Is it worth keeping? What would you change?

Well this was one i wanted to remove at the start of the season. But after scrimming it and matching on it i remember why i like. Lots of ways to attack the rocket, and one team is basicly given the rocket. And combine has to attack. It's different from other maps. I like to have different game play in my maps so i kinda cringe at people suggesting making it like every other map. But if their was one thing i would want to change, it would be increase the FPS outside. mainly when you get in draw range of the water you start to lag a bit. This was done in dods for this map that had standing water much like swamplight by just reducing the amount of water, still keeping the same feel.

This map in my opinion is one that doesn't really work in pubs but is great for teamplay. I like the slams on it because you can get outside and lock it down with them. It only has 2 slams on either sides of the map. That map isn't so tight where it restricts movement. Were slams would be really bad, like cannon_r1 that map is to tight for slams.