HL2DMU Forum Archive » Mapping Discussion

dm_amplitude_r2

Fearsome*

2009-01-21 17:29:58

So this map is on the slate for revision this season.
2 Issues I know of are the game player equip needs to be removed and the smg grenade near the rocket stops spawning and maybe should just be moved out of there.

There has been talk of adding a super charger at the top of the map.

Input opinions below.

Paradox

2009-01-21 20:02:05

Yes move the smg nade and the orb in rocket area to some other place in the map where they would be more effective. 200 suit charger at top might be an interesting juxtaposition to rpg.

I would also move at least one of the spawns (if not both) out of the rpg area, the one on the level near the 2 healthpacks and 2 suit pickups, is nothing but a spawnkill fest.

Sacrifist

2009-01-22 00:23:31

A super charger would make sense at the top considering there isnt much of a reason to go up there. Should possibly add some lights or something around the map to know that someone is charging up there to make things more interesting for the group holding out down at the rpg.

ninjins

2009-01-22 01:16:23

sounds interesting.

Fearsome*

2009-01-22 03:43:42

I was also thinking that to many people tend to travel through the upper hall near the xbow so I was going to put a laser in it that comes on and off in pulses and does damage what do you think?

Poor_Billy

2009-01-22 03:45:34

Fearsome* wrote:I was also thinking that to many people tend to travel through the upper hall near the xbow so I was going to put a laser in it that comes on and off in pulses and does damage what do you think?
sounds like a fearsome quality idea to me, oh wait...

edit: and swot is a 600x better mapper than you, so don't chirp.

Paradox

2009-01-22 04:02:07

Personally I dont think anything that causes damage because a player went that way or fell into (ie a toxic pit, spill, fan, etc) should be put into a map unless it is triggered by another player (it the fan plug in Lockdown, switch in swamplight).

st00pidity

2009-01-22 04:02:55

Fearsome* wrote:I was also thinking i should make 5 revisions of the same map and still get abso-fucking-lutely no where with it.

L2k

2009-01-22 04:09:45

Fearsome* wrote:I was also thinking that to many people tend to travel through the upper hall near the xbow so I was going to put a laser in it that comes on and off in pulses and does damage what do you think?
WTF

Poor_Billy

2009-01-22 04:52:47

L2k wrote:
Fearsome* wrote:I was also thinking that to many people tend to travel through the upper hall near the xbow so I was going to put a laser in it that comes on and off in pulses and does damage what do you think?
WTF
he's trying to shit talk octagon.

Blasphemy

2009-01-22 05:18:37

who cares

swot= makes good maps out of scratch (cept maybe for octagon which was a quake import if i am not mistaken)
fear= makes shitty revisions that other mappers made

keefy

2009-01-22 06:24:14

Fearsome* wrote: ...the game player equip needs to be removed

Input opinions below.
What is that?

Nutri-Grain

2009-01-22 06:49:31

.

Sadist

2009-01-22 06:53:35

keefy wrote:
Fearsome* wrote: ...the game player equip needs to be removed

Input opinions below.
What is that?
It is an entity which gives the player items (depending on what is set, it can be weapons, items etc) upon touching the game_player_equip, or when the game_player_equip is triggered.

It is useful for giving a player a multitude of items while only placing one entity.

ninjins

2009-01-22 08:17:26

Fearsome* wrote:I was also thinking that to many people tend to travel through the upper hall near the xbow so I was going to put a laser in it that comes on and off in pulses and does damage what do you think?
Put it in every room of LD. I wonder how many people would cry

L2k

2009-01-22 10:22:49

keefy wrote:
Fearsome* wrote: ...the game player equip needs to be removed

Input opinions below.
What is that?
Hes referring to removing the double melee equip that currently exists on Amp_r1 and Lockdown_r3

keefy

2009-01-22 12:33:19

L2k wrote:
keefy wrote:
Fearsome* wrote: ...the game player equip needs to be removed

Input opinions below.
What is that?
Hes referring to removing the double melee equip that currently exists on Amp_r1 and Lockdown_r3
Oh never noticed, I always select crowbar due to

Code: Select all

bind "1" "use weapon_stunstick; use weapon_crowbar"
No need to remove it, IMO amplitude needs no tweaking.
Do u have permision to edit?

Paradox

2009-01-22 19:51:44

The author is easily reachable so I am sure Fear talked to him. I would not be surprised if the author is doing the work himself.

Walking Target

2009-01-22 20:00:39

For those who aren't aware, double melee needs to be removed since it causes all kinds of bugs and increases crashes upon restart. The bug it was designed to overcome has also been fixed.

Zman42

2009-01-22 20:46:53

Walking Target wrote:For those who aren't aware, double melee needs to be removed since it causes all kinds of bugs and increases crashes upon restart. The bug it was designed to overcome has also been fixed.
:!:

Sadist

2009-01-22 21:17:41

Walking Target wrote:For those who aren't aware, double melee needs to be removed since it causes all kinds of bugs and increases crashes upon restart. The bug it was designed to overcome has also been fixed.
Hang on a second... you're saying that if a game_player_equip gives the player both melee weapons it can cause crashes? Because that would be most interesting concerning the crash rate in dm_centrum (which uses dual melee).

Sacrifist

2009-01-22 22:51:07

Sadist wrote:
Walking Target wrote:For those who aren't aware, double melee needs to be removed since it causes all kinds of bugs and increases crashes upon restart. The bug it was designed to overcome has also been fixed.
Hang on a second... you're saying that if a game_player_equip gives the player both melee weapons it can cause crashes? Because that would be most interesting concerning the crash rate in dm_centrum (which uses dual melee).
Yes, It causes crashes.

keefy

2009-01-23 06:17:23

Jumping while switching weapons causes crashes when hosting a listen server.

Fearsome*

2009-01-23 11:33:24

Using the game_player_equip just seems to increase crashes. It is most noticeable if people are spectating during a game restart. However I do not know that the issue it was trying to solve which is being able to hear people as they come into VIS with a stunstick has been fixed (clarification WT?). That is news to me and I still hear them. But in the end it caused more problems then it solved also since we run the same map both rounds the difference between combine and rebel is fair while still great. So it is better to take it out.

I hear people complaining about amplitude so now is the time give input.

The mapper who made the map is going to do the editing he does a good job of updating things.

And I was serious about the laser I need input please keep the flames out of this forum take it to the cafeteria.

Fearsome*

2009-01-23 11:43:01

Blasphemy wrote:who cares

swot= makes good maps out of scratch (cept maybe for octagon which was a quake import if i am not mistaken)
fear= makes shitty revisions that other mappers made
Swot made biohazard this map was called scary1 in hl1 it was not his original map
frenzy was another one he made it was also a hl1 map it is not his map original map either.
octagon was q3dm6 which had already been made for hl as pg_campgrouds once again not his original map.
Of the 4 maps you guys know he makes only lost arena may be an original work.

But swot does do a good job in his copies on the technical side of mapping I think my copy is good as well no beef between swot and myself. We are waiting for an update of la though to fix it for cal.

[EYE] Valar

2009-01-23 12:11:58

Fearsome* wrote:We are waiting for an update of la though to fix it for cal.
what's the problem in LA?

Fearsome*

2009-01-23 13:02:33

The lifts do not work well and he has made like 3 different versions of the map VIA entity update all with the same name each of these is an issue since many server admins do not even know which one they are running and players have no reasonably way to verify which one is right. Which means someone might pop out with a rocket in the middle of your match when you did not think their was one on the map.

Ko-Tao

2009-01-23 15:31:34

- Remove game_player_equip
- Add supercharger on top
- Add supercharger status lights in strategic locations
- Move rpg round from top
- Move orb from rpg area
- Adjust player spawns to minimize easy spawnkills
- Remove the majority of the sawblades
- Remove junk props that get underfoot and do minimal damage
- Fix those few pickups that randomly fail to respawn

Also, no lasers or any other gimmicks. Good teams will fix overused routes or excessively camped areas themselves via ambushes or spam.

0nti

2009-01-23 17:16:10

I' don't know if a supercharger would be fine on top, should have to test it. For some reason I like more the idea of adding more "batteries" or whatever u call em on top, rather than a supercharger, but as I said, I should have to try it to really know ;o

haymaker

2009-01-23 18:03:46

Sadist wrote: It is an entity which gives the player items (depending on what is set, it can be weapons, items etc) upon touching the game_player_equip, or when the game_player_equip is triggered.

It is useful for giving a player a multitude of items while only placing one entity.
/

can somebody explain if this entity breaks things in maps, I know the one in bio was removed for ggun reasons, but otherwise it functions without problems or not?

[EYE] Valar

2009-01-23 20:00:15

[EYE] Valar wrote: The lifts do not work well and he has made like 3 different versions of the map VIA entity update all with the same name each of these is an issue since many server admins do not even know which one they are running and players have no reasonably way to verify which one is right. Which means someone might pop out with a rocket in the middle of your match when you did not think their was one on the map.

i didn't write this :sketchy:

Walking Target

2009-01-23 20:35:34

Yeah I think Fearsome may have accidentally clicked edit instead of quote there Valar. I'll fix it.

Walking Target

2009-01-23 20:43:42

Fearsome* wrote:Using the game_player_equip just seems to increase crashes. It is most noticeable if people are spectating during a game restart. However I do not know that the issue it was trying to solve which is being able to hear people as they come into VIS with a stunstick has been fixed (clarification WT?). That is news to me and I still hear them. But in the end it caused more problems then it solved also since we run the same map both rounds the difference between combine and rebel is fair while still great. So it is better to take it out.
The original motivation for placing double melees from my recollection was the old bug where the crowbar would hit slower on linux servers. This could create uneven rounds since if you switched to the other teams linux server for your rebel round you would end up with a slower melee weapon than the other team that just played rebel on your windows server. I think many of the spectator bugs and crashes started happening when this bug was patched since I don't recall crashing much or seeing ghost melee weapons from spectators in double melee maps prior to that.

The vis bug, while an issue, is as you stated still fair since both teams must endure it as part of playing combine. The crashes far outweigh the benefits.

Oh yeah and Sadist, it sure does cause crashes. I have literally tried to run matches on double melee maps and had every single player crash at least once trying to start the map multiple times, switch to another double melee and it happens again. Switch to regular equip and not a single crash. I have also seen much more in game crashes in those maps during nightly scrims. It's anecdotal evidence, but I have seen so much it is pretty overwhelming.

[EYE] Valar

2009-01-23 21:04:06

haymaker wrote:can somebody explain if this entity breaks things in maps, I know the one in bio was removed for ggun reasons, but otherwise it functions without problems or not?
many of Source ents are broken in DM. player_equip is one of them. sometimes it would not work, not work properly, crash the server, crash the client, produce all sorts of weirdness etc.
damn shame innit. :cry:
i will note though, since my early days of mapping i've grown fond of using an OnMapSpawn triggered player_equip to give all players a set of weapons in most of my killboxes. this NEVER EVER crashed or produced ANY issues.
Since an essential part of competitive play is picking up weapons / items an OnMapSpawn doesn't make much sense and the mapper will need to rely on trigger volumes triggering the equip in locations in the map = which is actually the only aspect of this ent that is broken. I personally think, and again, that is personal opinion, this has direct connection with players rates and in general, their connection quality to the server at a given time (as we know, this has to do with a multitude of factors). as mappers who delve into Source IO in DM see again and again how IOs that are dealing with anything that has to do with rates / hitreg will be most likely broken / not function well / randomly act up.

so sad. and for that and honestly for that alone i would be one mad happy bastard to see DM port to OB.


val

Sadist

2009-01-23 21:22:02

Since this is the case, I might revisit centrum and explore other ways to give players melee, possibly just sticks only and crowbars to pick up. Maybe there is another to give double melee without using game_equip.

Thanks for the information guys.

Poor_Billy

2009-01-23 21:27:40

Fearsome* wrote: And I was serious about the laser I need input please keep the flames out of this forum take it to the cafeteria.
a laser in amplitude? since it's a futuristic map like octagon right? you're an idiot.worst idea ever.

cbegrimreaper

2009-01-23 23:09:12

Ko-Tao wrote:- Remove game_player_equip
- Add supercharger on top
- Add supercharger status lights in strategic locations
- Move rpg round from top
- Move orb from rpg area
- Adjust player spawns to minimize easy spawnkills
- Remove the majority of the sawblades
- Remove junk props that get underfoot and do minimal damage
- Fix those few pickups that randomly fail to respawn

Also, no lasers or any other gimmicks. Good teams will fix overused routes or excessively camped areas themselves via ambushes or spam.
Why (out of of pure curiousity with no agenda on my part) would you want to get rid of the sawblades? Would you replace them with a different object that achieves the same result i.e. radiator? Or just to get rid of them to reduce the number of grav objects?

I would think the dm community, in trying to promote the grav gun as one of the unique features of hl2dm, would want more grav objects in maps... but i digress, i am just curious why you wants less sawblades in this particular map where i think they offset the xbow,mag, and shotty very well in the corridors...

Thanks

Grim

The Argumentalizer

2009-01-23 23:22:19

Add a bounce pad in the middle for cool ass flying RPG shots. That way, those holding the RPG can REALLY dominate.
And move everything around a bit so as to confuse everyone.
Then make 6 more versions so folks can brush up on DLing stuff to their servers.

Why would you put a charger up top and signal to the strong area someone is using it?!?!?

How about leave it completely alone instead of adding a few folks little pet projects.

(some more sawblades and bricks to toss down stairwells and another charger would be cool)

Ko-Tao

2009-01-24 05:08:20

Saws in maps with alot narrow / twisty corridors (which are plentiful on amp) tend to be somewhat overpowered, in that you can carry them around silently and get an instant free kill if you happen to meet someone around a blind corner. Anything else (mag hs aside, which obviously takes much more skill to land in a sudden encounter than a prop) has less than lethal damage, causes self damage at close range or has warmup time, and other props generally arent worth carrying around as they obscure vision, arent guaranteed to kill in 1 shot, may not fly well and are much easier to catch.

I dont recall offhand exactly how many saws the map contains, but i think itd be fairly safe to cut the number in half. Those removed can always be replaced with different props, maybe a couple of those large blue barrels that generally do lethal damage and make good hitscan shields.
The Argumentalizer wrote:Why would you put a charger up top and signal to the strong area someone is using it?!?!?
Indicator lights arent there to show when the charger is being used, but to display its state of charge (full, half, empty). Of course if you see it drop from green to yellow, you know its being patronized, and have to decide whether or not its worth rushing before they get a full charge, at risk of a waiting ambush. Also, due to the visleaf layout on amp, players with good sound would be able to hear the charger being used from all areas of the map anyway.

Paradox

2009-01-25 01:23:26

Fearsome* wrote:And I was serious about the laser I need input please keep the flames out of this forum take it to the cafeteria.

I am serious too....DONT DO IT. Worst thing ever to put in a map just like toxic puddles. Why should a player be punished for using a corridor or path that was put in the map. You will ruin the flow and it will just make it retarded and people will hate it. People use the RPG alot, maybe we should take health points away from them every time they shoot it. If you dont want people to use it, it should not be in the map.

<kyle>

2009-01-25 22:48:09

try making a notch near the top of the pillar where the RPG is and placing the RPG in it and have a sound go off when someone takes it.

Nutri-Grain

2009-01-26 01:31:37

.

CellarDweller

2009-01-26 03:17:23

i think the laser idea is bad.

not sure i agree with a supercharger up top. but maybe a box charger or batteries.

i like the sawblades. im also not sure how many there are, but i dont seem to be tripping all over them. they do seem a little out of place to the theme of the map though. maybe radiators would be better.

remove orb and smg nade and half the batteries from rpg.

do you really need any kind of sound to let you know that people are going run like the wind and grab the rpg???? :mrgreen:

Jelly Fox

2009-01-26 03:26:22

:agree:

L2k

2009-01-26 03:35:10

why they hell do you have to keep going on changing maps, adding this, taking that, its not needed. Since you only tend to make the revision according to your own ideals and that of your followers in the end, why bother asking what other people want.

The only thing that needs to be done is to remove the mistake of r1 and take off the double melee.

Ko-Tao

2009-01-26 07:39:30

Its not that the saws clutter up the map or get underfoot; theyre the prop least likely to cause those sorts of issues. They just happen to be rather strong in a setting where you can use them to autowin sudden blind encounters in narrow corridors, and the map contains quite a few. Hardly the worst issue with the map though, so im not really concerned if their count gets altered or not.

One of the main changes of r1 was to remove slams, and i cant imagine many of us want to see those return. Im also fine with regular map updating, but it needs to be in the form of actual performance / gameplay improvement (such as the fixed lifts, doors, timers and weapon spawns in biohazard_cal), not random edits that cause as many problems as they cure and piss off half the player base (such as the majority of the lockdown_rX changes).

Da1

2009-01-28 04:05:25

Fix the double mele and the issue with the non respawns, gg the end.

The map is fine besides that.

No lasers, chargers or item movement.

PERIOD.

Zman42

2009-01-28 05:37:50

Da1 wrote:Fix the double mele and the issue with the non respawns, gg the end.

The map is fine besides that.

No lasers, chargers or item movement.

PERIOD.
good call actually.

Deathwish

2009-01-28 06:23:48

Having both Stunstick and Crowbar has an advantage though, the stunstick being carried gives off a beacon every now and then which makes it a bit harder for people wanting to camp around corners.

Zman42

2009-01-28 07:36:55

Deathwish wrote:Having both Stunstick and Crowbar has an advantage though, the stunstick being carried gives off a beacon every now and then which makes it a bit harder for people wanting to camp around corners.
LOL. thats not supposed to happen, also it causes crashes.

ninjins

2009-01-28 21:46:02

Zman42 wrote:
Deathwish wrote:Having both Stunstick and Crowbar has an advantage though, the stunstick being carried gives off a beacon every now and then which makes it a bit harder for people wanting to camp around corners.
LOL. thats not supposed to happen, also it causes crashes.
hahahahha. also the laser is a fantastic idea

Super Luigi

2009-01-29 19:38:37

When ever someone takes the RPG, have a huge comet come down and squash them

kkthxbai

Zman42

2009-01-29 20:12:42

Super Luigi wrote:When ever someone takes the RPG, have a huge comet come down and squash them

kkthxbai
what a fantastic idea! :sketchy:

L2k

2009-01-29 20:25:47

Zman42 wrote:
Super Luigi wrote:When ever someone takes the RPG, have a huge comet come down and squash them

kkthxbai
what a fantastic idea! :sketchy:
Can we get this on all CAL maps?
TY in advance

Sacrifist

2009-01-29 22:59:39

How about removing the rpg completely. That way the entire map will actually get played instead of 1/3 of it lol. Then you can have the comet come down if someone grabs the xbow.

[EYE] Valar

2009-01-30 02:11:36

i don't bhop and i don't do cal and who am i to judge and all that gibberish...but i think dm_amplitude is a feat of mapping and anything in its gameplay once changed will kill it period.
i find its gameplay lacking something but its not the RPG or the sawblades, their positioning in the map or the fact they exist with or without alarms about them. i think the gameplay issue is in the layout and not in the wep placement, etc.
i disagree only third or half of it it being played. i disagree sawblades or the RPG are overpowered. i think amplitude should be left as is. like it? play it. don't like it? don't play it. my personal opinion.
and again...most of us mappers just look at amplitude and go WTF iS THIS!!!!!! this guy has to be an alien or someit. i mean WOW.

little val

Paradox

2009-01-30 03:04:58

Have to agree that in terms of map design and architecture, Amplitude is WOW!

Ko-Tao

2009-01-30 03:18:38

Sacrifist wrote:How about removing the rpg completely. That way the entire map will actually get played instead of 1/3 of it lol. Then you can have the comet come down if someone grabs the xbow.
Thats the idea behind a supercharger up top, players will have reason to roam the entire map and move between the control points (or be forced to use everything inbetween the control points in a 2v2 if they manage to lose them both), instead of just clusterfucking around the rpg area for 90% of the match and leaving vast chunks of the map relatively untouched.

Agree about the mappers architecture... in that dept, hes got some serious skills. Cannon was pretty strong in this regard as well.

[EYE] Valar

2009-01-30 05:04:54

Ko-Tao wrote:Cannon was pretty strong in this regard as well.
very true, but again - a labyrinth. these maps consist of a seek&destroy puzzle style gameplay.

Paradox

2009-01-30 07:42:56

Cannon is also interesting from a design stand point and it makes an excellent pub map for at least 10 people. It makes a terrible competative map as we all know.

Fearsome*

2009-01-31 10:16:02

Well I think the layout of amplitude is very good. It is not nice easy to understand squared rooms and that challenges people to think and use their brains more then would more simple maps. So far from matches I have seen some really do camp down at the rocket. I think a couple of things people touched on could be altered to cause more conflict.

Move the smg nade near rocket a little up the stairs. (fix spawning) encourages rocket controllers to move out of their comfort zone to get it a little.
Move the AR2 into the large courtyard in the bottom on a flat surface. Encourages rocket controllers to venture out where they are weak from above and attackers to venture down to get it.
Maybe a super charger is over kill and I think that it is nice to have some variety on maps if amp does not have one thats not bad. So what about 1 or 2 30 HEV chargers on the top. This will encourage rocket controllers to go out and try to hit people as they charge or run up from rocket 2 to the top.

I don't yet see a consensus on saw blades there are 2 in the map right now.

Many people tell me they cant find their way around the map cause things are not recognizable if people could list the worst rooms or where they are having the most trouble we could have some sort of landmark added perhaps.

0nti

2009-01-31 17:46:38

Fearsome* wrote:So what about 1 or 2 30 HEV chargers on the top. This will encourage rocket controllers to go out and try to hit people as they charge or run up from rocket 2 to the top
I Agree
Fearsome* wrote: Many people tell me they cant find their way around the map cause things are not recognizable if people could list the worst rooms or where they are having the most trouble we could have some sort of landmark added perhaps.
I Agree
Fearsome* wrote:Move the smg nade near rocket a little up the stairs. (fix spawning) encourages rocket controllers to move out of their comfort zone to get it a little.
Move the AR2 into the large courtyard in the bottom on a flat surface. Encourages rocket controllers to venture out where they are weak from above and attackers to venture down to get it.
Maybe a super charger is over kill and I think that it is nice to have some variety on maps if amp does not have one thats not bad. So what about 1 or 2 30 HEV chargers on the top. This will encourage rocket controllers to go out and try to hit people as they charge or run up from rocket 2 to the top.
Should see this done and try it, but sounds good.
btw, no laser plz ^_^

Paradox

2009-01-31 18:42:32

Two sawblades are fine, and it allows for some use of the grav gun on that map. I would leave them because it does give an option for a weapon.

Yea I think a couple of suit chargers would be fine if the super is felt to be too much.

I would also move the player spawns out of the rocket area. One of them in particular causes a ton of rocket spawn kills because of the fact that its the most used area on the map because of the rocket.

badinfluence

2009-01-31 18:49:11

I don't know about you, but in a 4v4, I wouldn't go up to the top for two HEV chargers.

Paradox

2009-01-31 18:57:14

Yea I kind of agree with you BI. I was thinking that it might be better to have a charger over by the xbow and one somewhere else in the map. The top area is kinda exposed to rocket spam.

badinfluence

2009-01-31 21:10:59

The rocket takes out almost everything. From my point of view, I wouldn't wander anywhere for anything else. I'd just stay by that rpg.

Fearsome*

2009-01-31 21:25:57

badinfluence wrote:The rocket takes out almost everything. From my point of view, I wouldn't wander anywhere for anything else. I'd just stay by that rpg.
If you heard someone charging you would not try to wrap a rocket up there to get them?

badinfluence

2009-01-31 21:32:51

No, I wouldn't. My name isn't MODaL.

; D

Zman42

2009-02-01 01:45:49

badinfluence wrote:The rocket takes out almost everything. From my point of view, I wouldn't wander anywhere for anything else. I'd just stay by that rpg.
staying right at the rpg won't work against a decent team, they'll eventually nail you.

keefy

2009-02-01 02:39:15

The RPG is a control point, you need to overcome the team that controls it that's how this game seems to work. The only way around camping the RPG is to create some kind of system where the RPG is available for pickup every 2 minutes or so.

[EYE] Valar

2009-02-01 04:07:33

keefy wrote:The only way around camping the RPG is to create some kind of system where the RPG is available for pickup every 2 minutes or so.
but that results in frustration in game man. i think i prefer, personally, to set much shorter timers and in return make the RPG pickup spot much more vulnerable.
= camp away, but with a price.

Ko-Tao

2009-02-01 13:35:49

Didnt realize there were only 2 saws total. I guess having a couple of 50-3 type pub rounds there using the same saw the whole time gave a warped impression. Anyway, 2 saws is obviously fine.

I wouldnt go up top for a pair of 30 chargers either, way too slow and noisy for the reward. 4x suit, maybe, but its still minimal reason to leave an area with similar armor, more life, rocket, orb, smgnade and a camp spot that can watch every available entrance.

Supercharger up top fixes two problems- 1, the rocket almost always being a one shot kill when used on a visible opponent, and 2, the majority of a rather large maps gameplay revolving around 1 cramped room. Move the ar while were at it and everyones suddenly got great reason to actually travel around the whole map, or make a choice between which area to control, or how far to split up the team to control all the best areas. The gameplay can only get better and more diverse in the end.

And lastly, no dm_octagon style gimmicks (toggled lasers, random healing zones, orb chutes, mobile stairs that occasionally trap or kill players, etc, etc). If an odd feature doesnt directly add strong gameplay value (rpg door / spam door triggers on bio, secret room trigger on tigcrik, etc) then it has no place in a league map.

keefy

2009-02-01 16:13:42

[EYE] Valar wrote:
keefy wrote:The only way around camping the RPG is to create some kind of system where the RPG is available for pickup every 2 minutes or so.
but that results in frustration in game man. i think i prefer, personally, to set much shorter timers and in return make the RPG pickup spot much more vulnerable.
= camp away, but with a price.
Like removing all HP and armour pickups from that area?


20 min match = can get RPG 10 times which is 30 shots not counting the ammo lying around.
2mins is just and example but I think 1 min is too short. The wapons already respawn every 30 seconds.

Paradox

2009-02-01 19:11:24

Keefy brings up a good point.

Since people do like to camp the rocket, it might be best to move the health and suit pickups from there to give them more reason to leave.

[EYE] Valar

2009-02-01 19:20:09

well...try it and see :)

i think this will totally break the game flow. making the layout and situation for the RPG harder i think will work better than having ppl literally wait for 1 or 2 minutes on a DM map for a weapon. even as powerful. the idea is absolutely spot on and i couldn't agree more but i think this should be achieved in a different manner.

val

Fearsome*

2009-02-03 22:22:05

Actually weapons respawn every 20 seconds, not 30. Items and ammo respawn every 30 seconds. I never really did understand why valve did this but it certainly makes it so aside from orbs and smg grenades most people do not bother memorizing or controling ammo. Many times I think the weapon respawn should be reduced to 30 like ammo. But that is another discussion outside of this map.

Also I am think if you make alot of small changes they will really add up. Without the need to completely change the game play. smg, and orb moved away from the rocket as well as a couple spawns and maybe we should move the health and armor at rocket floor 1 up to rocket floor 2. And you put supplies just a little out of reach where they have to go get them and just in reach where attackers can grab them. That creates good conflict and forced interaction. People meet and fight over resources.

HL2DMU Forum Archive » Mapping Discussion