dm_stad by Oskmos - HL2DMU Forum Archive

Oskmos

2009-04-10 17:06:00

Howdy, dm_stad is my map that i made for the mapping contest. its main focus is around fun gameplay with "jump-ramps" at the courners that send people flying like in quake 3 arena for example. feel free to tell me what you think about the map if you try it out.

http://www.map-factory.org/half-life-2/ ... -stad-1320

So, the idea of dm_stad ("stad" means town/city in swedish) is that some sort of company drives around in their big trucks from town to town, killing the locals, and setting up deathmatches for people to watch and bet money on.
They have put up fences to keep the combatants inside the "arena", and in this case they have put these "jump-ramps" at all 4 cournes of the arena to crank things up a notch, BAM!
The combatants are the locals, that weren't too old or too young to fight (notice the tags on each house front door), accompanied by the winner from the previous town this company visited. I call it "Deathmatch on Tour". The trucks can be seen outside the map where there's also some grandstand for the spectators.

badinfluence

2009-04-10 17:26:47

I liked this map. I just thought it was too mazey.

CellarDweller

2009-04-10 18:11:20

i really like the pics you've posted. im not sure how it would play, but i may give it a download just to get a better a look at the entire map. i like the gloomy atmosphere. i like the contrast of the chalked out hopscotch on the ground with the red X on the door. makes you think, somethings not quite right here. what happened? mysterious and menacing. i think your map is quite artistic looking. when i look at the pics, i see an unknown story... something tragic or terrible that needs to be explored.

haymaker

2009-04-10 18:38:25

I like this too, and I agree with Bad Influence's comment.Love that conveyor belt/jump pad
idea, very elegant. LOL Deatmatch on Tour, one of the many nice little touches that show
attention to detail in making this, like the hopscotch decal. This is one of the most
realized maps I've seen for bringing a theme to. For some reason I keep thinking Sunnyvale
Trailer Park.

Minuses: The layout works but seems a tad repetitive; borderline performance in more than a
couple of areas; stairwell is much too dark ( I know it fits the theme but no good for
gameplay ); white texture bug on the bbq and concrete block model; can't shoot through the
hedges; some details should be non-solid for player movement.

You certainly know what you're doing in the editor. Let's see some more of your work!

Oskmos

2009-04-10 19:01:02

the white texture bug is because of the phong-shaders, i dont get it on my computer, anyone else?
might be because the "phong_normal.vtf" is missing in the packed .bmp
are you running on a dx7 or dx8 card?

It seems that all the things that i think makes this map fun, is what all you think is bad about the map

so I would like to point out that i didnt think one thought when making this map that it would be used in any sort of competition, i basically made it for random public servers or LANs

Paradox

2009-04-11 04:30:22

This map would make a really fun pub map. All you need to do is sprinkle some more weapons among the houses and the field and add some lighting to the stair well and I think it would be alot of fun.

Da1

2009-04-11 05:00:14

Paradox wrote:This map would make a really fun pub map. All you need to do is sprinkle some more weapons among the houses and the field and add some lighting to the stair well and I think it would be alot of fun.

100% Agree with that.

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-11 05:00:56

Oskmos wrote:the white texture bug is because of the phong-shaders, i dont get it on my computer, anyone else?
might be because the "phong_normal.vtf" is missing in the packed .bmp
are you running on a dx7 or dx8 card?

It seems that all the things that i think makes this map fun, is what all you think is bad about the map
so I would like to point out that i didnt think one thought when making this map that it would be used in any sort of competition, i basically made it for random public servers or LANs

Oskmos, phong-shaders are not supported under ep1 engine (thx to boshed for the insight and link

)
best edit those lines out (add a // in front of the command) in the VMTs they're in and release along with any other fixes (if you're intending on doing any bug fixing that is).
i'm DL'ing now. but looking at the screens this is WOW. very L4D. very interesting. and as haymaker pointed out - you're an interesting mapper we would sure like to see more coming from you in the future. Great job.
now lemme go DL and hurry back to trash you're work. just a sec.
jk

EDIT: hold it right there!!! did you make Cabin or just revised it? OMG i used to this map when i was just a little valar back in the day.

val

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-11 05:33:35

ok. seen the map.
it's a.m.a.z.i.n.g period.
tons of problems for hl2dm but i don't care. it's too amazing to be rated.

now! please teach me reskining and modeling. please. thank you.

Oskmos

2009-04-11 06:19:58

[EYE] Valar wrote:EDIT: hold it right there!!! did you make Cabin or just revised it?

what do you mean? whats Cabin?
btw i'm really glad you liked the map!

And about the Phong-shaders, it works on my computer, and my laptop, and every other computer i've run this map on. they added phong shaders for episode 1, and then after that they updated all games previous of ep1 with the same features, (HDR and phong-shader etc...) And that bug with the props turning white is really wierd, its only when the props are standing still that they are white.
if more people report this error, i guess i have to edit the .VMT but i've already uploaded the map

About the lighting in the staircase, im gonna leave it pitch-black, to much work for such a small thing, and i dont really see the problem, i kind of like the gameplay that occurs in there. kaotik and intense

and a nice contrast to the, sometimes, long distance combat found outside the house. (and also a nice contrast to the overall brightness of the map)

Oskmos

2009-04-11 06:30:26

Paradox wrote:This map would make a really fun pub map. All you need to do is sprinkle some more weapons among the houses and the field and add some lighting to the stair well and I think it would be alot of fun.

I've put the weapons fairly close to the jump-ramps (located at the courners next to the smg1-grenades) and the crossbows on top of the center-house to make people use the ramps. So placing more weapons down by the houses would make it less important to use the ramps, so im satisfied with weapon placement.

Here's a map i made that shows where all pick-ups are located except for some slams thats inside the center-house (the map shows the old version without the pine trees. And i think the placement of frags is still the same)

Walking Target

2009-04-11 08:31:08

I think the pickups were well placed, but I think paradox is envisaging a very busy pub with lots of players, so the concern is that they will get used up fast.

First time I loaded up stad it made me think "wow this is very cool". It is unfortunate that it wasn't quite what we were looking for in terms of the contest theme, since it is such a great map otherwise.

Paradox

2009-04-11 09:09:51

Yes that was my point WT. You should split up the crossbows. Put one on the ground somewhere, add another mag somewhere on the opposite side from where there is one now. Also a couple more batteries and med kits on the ground. Where are the orbs?

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-11 09:42:30

ahh. no inputo or requesto receivo fello.

well, nothing's perfect is it

. still awesome work.

Sacrifist

2009-04-11 10:05:56

This map would make a great Domination map in HL2CTF.

Oskmos

2009-04-11 15:56:17

Paradox wrote:Yes that was my point WT. You should split up the crossbows. Put one on the ground somewhere, add another mag somewhere on the opposite side from where there is one now. Also a couple more batteries and med kits on the ground. Where are the orbs?

next to the AR2, but they are rather useless on this map

well if someone wants to put this up for a public-server with many players, you can allways use 'weaponstay'. I'm satisified with wepaonplacement. I want to make people use the ramps as much as i can without making it obvious. So splitting up the crossbows would work against that goal. But hey, the .357 is far away, and that can be used as a sniper of sorts

lol, i just found these two:

Paradox

2009-04-11 20:47:28

Weaponstay? I am not sure what that is.

For a pub map it doesnt have enough weapons also having 2 crossbows right next to each other is a bit odd. Ask Valar how many times he has had to adjust weapons in a map. LOL! Adding a couple of weapons and healthpacks etc would be a pretty easy fix. Its disappointing that you are unwilling to change it because it would be alot of fun to play. As it is, I probably wont run it because there just wont be enough weapons in a pub atmosphere and that will kill the fun on the map if people cant get a weapon. Oh well.

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-11 22:09:44

same here. although, enthralled, i shall stray in this foggy land to forgetfulness.. and sigh.
locally.

Oskmos

2009-04-11 23:44:42

weaponstay means weapons dont dissapear when you pick them up, so others can pick them up right after you. I think the cvar is 'mp_weaponstay 1'

I think there's enough weapons, the map may look big, but its not, so you'r never far away from weapons. And with the ramps you can basically get any weapon you want with-in 10 seconds from spawn. We have played this with like 8 poeple in it and the lack of weapons was never a problem. If you still think there's a lack of weapons for public servers, just use weaponstay. The map is finnished, i wont go back to change anything, im as satisfied as one can be.

Paradox wrote:having 2 crossbows right next to each other is a bit odd

It increases the chance for a crossbow to be avalible for pick-up for those who get up there. And to get up there (the easiest way) you use the ramps. Wich we all know by now is what i want people to do.

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-11 23:56:52

verily, your obtuseness matches your talent. cheers on both.
move on yawls.

haymaker

2009-04-12 00:25:48

Oskmos wrote: And to get up there (the easiest way) you use the ramps. Wich we all know by now is what i want people to do.

You may be wanting that, but in practice a lot of the time jumps/pushes result in the player being an easier target while in the air for a good mag user. Plus there's fall damage as an annoyance. There's plenty of maps out there that fall prey to this ( I made one of them ). As a player I would probably avoid using them as a destination constantly.

Paradox

2009-04-12 02:06:13

Then it is probably good you didnt make top 3 because the next step is to work with the judges to improve your map. It would not have won as is.

Yep Valar, Im gona write this one off damn shame too.

Oskmos

2009-04-12 02:08:38

if i would have won, i would of course make some changes. but i didn't and i dont think that adding more weapons will improve the map, simple as that!

ninojman

2009-04-13 05:23:56

Weaponstay makes it so you can't pick up the frags, so using that would take out 4 of the pick-ups.

I liked the theme. To much repetition though, and you can get lost and never find any weapons from spawn points. Biggest drawback that I found was the RPG is easy to get and then you can get on a jump pad that leads to another jump pad. Not to mention that the pads have all kinds of pick-ups nearby. So for a pub, that is all you would need. Grab rpg, jump in air, Rain down the Rpg and smg_nades. If all of the pick-ups were moved away from the pads it would be a lot better. making the rpg in a house with a hole in the roof and the only way to get it would be to jump in the middle. So you have no fast track to the pads would go a long way also.

These pads are fast enough and at an angle were you aren't gonna mag them down easily. Speaking of mags, they would be a lot of fun on this map, but good luck finding one.

Fun Map though thank you for your time spent etc.

Oskmos

2009-04-13 05:45:42

This map has very different gameplay from other hl2dm-maps, some would say thats bad, some would say its good. All my maps have more or less different gameplay. I'll post some of my older maps that i havent released to the public before, but we have played them on LANs alot and they are really fun (i think)

ninojman wrote:So for a pub, that is all you would need. Grab rpg, jump in air, Rain down the Rpg and smg_nades.

Thats true, i guess this map isn't so good for public after all, at least not for noobs (when a skilled player is on the server)

Btw, thanks all for the feedback! And sorry for being stubborn, I guess I'm just dissapointed that i lost in the competition, so I got all defensive about my map that i've worked on for 2-3 months

Sacrifist

2009-04-13 07:27:08

Oskmos wrote:Btw, thanks all for the feedback! And sorry for being stubborn, I guess I'm just dissapointed that i lost in the competition, so I got all defensive about my map that i've worked on for 2-3 months

It would be a shame for 2-3 months of work to go overlooked because you wouldnt move around some weapons and items. I really hope you convert this to a Domination map when the next hl2ctf version is released. This type of map would work very well with it's Domination mode.

ninojman

2009-04-13 08:54:12

Ya I liked this one for a bit. Still has promise to be a fun map

Paradox

2009-04-13 09:20:13

No map is good for a noob when a skilled player is on the map. One of the reasons I liked this map was for the different game play.

Nino has some good points though. I still think it could make a fun pub map.

Oskmos

2009-04-13 16:28:18

i'll make a dm_stad_final with more weapons, relocated RPG and with lights in the staircase for you guys. But I probably wont play it myself, i really like the map as it is. oh well, i'll post later with a link to the new map.

ninojman wrote:making the rpg in a house with a hole in the roof and the only way to get it would be to jump in the middle. So you have no fast track to the pads would go a long way also.

Maybe the RPG can be inside some sort of basement in the center house, as far away from jump ramps as possible, although close to the highest point of the map...

ninojman wrote:Not to mention that the pads have all kinds of pick-ups nearby

Well, the healthpacks are there so that anyone can use the ramp without dying from fall damage. But should I remove the smg1_grenades?

Shoobie

2009-04-13 17:02:27

This map makes me feel like home. Sverige ftw! The hammer skills on this one is amazing, it looks really real. I could just have walked out of my house and step into this little town. Great work dude. Add me if you want and we can talk bit about the map. Tomsalt is my steam name.

Den svenska småstadsidyllen. Trevlikgt, trevligt

Oskmos

2009-04-13 17:44:59

I've made changes to the weaponlayout, havent playtested it yet though. I made a new overview-map so its easier to see if some of the weapons are too close to one another etc.

edit: i played with the new weaponlayout 1 on 1, and its not as much fun. Gonna try and get more people to join to see if its better for public.

BlackRaven

2009-04-13 21:19:38

after i saw the screenshots, they immediately made me think of l4d with all those trees and the mist. looks cool.

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-14 01:33:18

Hey Oskmos,

You seem to be quite an intelligent person so i'm going to go ahead and tell you what i think without sugar-coating it too much

if you're mapping for yourself that's fine and you're right not to take any inputs or even care what people might think of your work. BUT, if you're mapping for people to play your map my advise to you is this - put your ego aside and LISTEN to what people tell you. You don't have to swallow every but you have to take it into consideration, try to understand if there's a reasonable input here of just BS from someone who doesn't know anything about anything. filter but don't block.

I know many will disagree with the following but this is what i think. personal opinion:

My mapping philosophy for what its worth is that the people (who are actually going to play my map) and i are ONE UNIT.
And as a ONE UNIT, the people and the mapper work TOGETHER on making the map a success. in other words; you NEED people to HELP YOU make a GOOD MAP. Open up to input; not only this is the correct way of creating for public but also because there is no way around it.

I know how it feels to not win and you think How could they NOT see how amazing my map is (and i'm being serious) but this is exactly the path we take as creators; not always do people feel the way WE DO about our own creations.

I truly hope we'll see more stuff coming from you. You've great talent - hope your ego can help it and not hinder it.

val

Oskmos

2009-04-14 01:57:00

I think that the reason for my maps beeing so different is because im doing it wrong

I consider my self an environment-artist and not a level-designer. So when im gonna start building a map, im thinking about how the map will look, and what setting it will take place in. Not about layout, ie for dm_stad, i wanted to build a map of a small swedish "stad" (city). this way of doing things often makes my maps really different, and most of the time it works really well.
Not once have i made any large change to my brushwork after the map has been playtested. But im not totally oblivious to what would play well and what wouldn't. But im just telling you, i basically build maps to make them pretty.

So i guess thats why my maps are so different. When it comes to dm_stad, i didn't want to listen to the feedback and make a map like all the other maps out there. I'ts like there's a right and a wrong when it comes to how a map should be like, and how the different weapons should be placed.

Paradox

2009-04-14 02:40:48

I dont think that there is a right or a wrong to making a map. In fact sometimes different is good, it makes it interesting. Your map is interesting and it is a good map. I liked the city aspect of it. I dont have much of a clue on how to make maps. I have however played alot of maps and I do have an idea what makes a map a good/great map and what makes a map fun. I really dont believe it would take much to make it into a great map.

As far as not winning, well there were 22 maps and it was a really really really hard choice. There is alot of great material here and to be honest it is more important to me that we get some great, fun new maps to play on for both pubs and for competition and honestly IMO the pubs are more important because we all start out as pub players whether we are willling to admit that or not.

Walking Target

2009-04-14 03:37:34

Oskmos wrote:I consider my self an environment-artist

If the contest was environment art oriented, I think your map would most certainly be top three. It was definitely the most atmospheric for me.

Whatever you decide to do with it, be proud regardless. It was a fine entry, and a very interesting map to review.

[MB]Brunt

2009-04-14 04:16:28

i to would press for a few mow weapons around the map.i played it with 14 lastnite.fun with the jumps but it was mostly a smg fight.you should realy try workin with thes guys on the weapons placement.nice layout but the weapons placement a bit thin for free forall pub play.

Paradox

2009-04-14 05:33:23

LOL I will try it out on my TDM pub Oskmos, but so far your changes look good, but Ill have to try it to be sure.

Cynips

2009-04-14 10:27:38

Walking Target wrote:
Oskmos wrote:I consider my self an environment-artist
If the contest was environment art oriented, I think your map would most certainly be top three. It was definitely the most atmospheric for me.

Yeah until I realized the (unfortunate) gameplay shortcomings of this map, it was definitely one of my top maps. Almost so I was wondering if it had anything to do with me myself being Swedish

Oskmos

2009-04-14 22:00:29

Paradox wrote:LOL I will try it out on my TDM pub Oskmos, but so far your changes look good, but Ill have to try it to be sure.

The new map hasn't been uploaded yet. I think i will make a dm_stad_pub and keep the old dm_stad as it is, for 1 on 1 etc.

I'll post later when its avalible for download.

Oskmos

2009-04-15 03:07:58

A map that i made for the... level. Not that i think it will help much with finding weapons (that shouldn't be such a big problem now that i added more), I just thought it was a fun idea. It also tells you that the map takes place in sweden (if you know swedish that is

)

Shoobie wrote:Den svenska småstadsidyllen. Trevlikgt, trevligt

Jag vart insipirerad och döpte staden till Idyllköping!

[EYE] Valar

2009-04-15 03:50:42

Oskmos

2009-04-15 04:02:00

[EYE] Valar wrote:

LOL

Walking Target

2009-04-15 06:25:45

That's awesome man.

Paradox

2009-04-15 06:37:13

LMAO!

Cynips

2009-04-15 10:21:59

LOL, snyggt jobbat!

Oskmos

2009-04-16 23:58:36

http://files.filefront.com/dm+stad+fina ... einfo.html
there we go! I have not tested the weapon layout with more than 4 people so I dont know how it will play. If anyone of you do play it on a crowded server, please let me know how it plays.

So the changes are:

-RPG is in the basement of the center house
-Staircase has been lit up and widened so that you can jump from the top floor all the way down to the RPG
-smg1_grenades has been removed from the ramps, 2 has been placed where the RPG used to be and 1 on top of the 2-story building in the center
-More weapons!
-And some new deciduous trees

boshed

2009-04-17 02:29:25

Love the map

Glad to see you've revised this, its a great piece of work.

Duke Nukem

2009-04-21 20:04:43

you should think about getting this into css

Oskmos

2009-04-22 02:22:51

Duke Nukem wrote:you should think about getting this into css

I alreaddy tried that

but it was no fun.

Oskmos

2009-04-26 05:02:14

http://www.map-factory.org/half-life-2/ ... final-1330

koncentrate

2009-06-24 15:19:02

is there a working link? for me no link works :/

Hammer-of-Doom

2009-06-28 21:26:04

The conveyor belt/jump pads are awesome! I am guessing you made the models?

Oskmos

2009-06-29 12:20:15

yes, i made all the custom props/textures. Glad you liked it

koncentrate

2009-06-29 23:07:35

koncentrate wrote:is there a working link? for me no link works :/

Maxtasy

2009-07-01 11:16:48

koncentrate wrote:
koncentrate wrote:is there a working link? for me no link works :/

mirror

KLick!

koncentrate

2009-07-02 13:28:22

thx