dm_Asylum

dm asylum

This HL2DM level was designed as a mid 20th century abandoned lunatic asylum, using real locations in both England and the US as reference.

The level was built first and foremost with competitive game in mind, featuring close quarter areas and more opened ones, control points and choke points.
It is large enough for 3v3, 4v4 and pubs while fast and properly connected, hopefully to do well for 1v1 and 2v2 matches as well.

The layout consists of two main areas connected with a long L-shaped hallway while several interconnections “criss-cross” between the different rooms.
Of the two main halls one contains a Supercharger and is in proximity to several power weapons (AR2 + CB, Mag, Xbow and an RPG in the underground level) however is rather remote by design
while the other main hall contains an AR2 + CB, SMG Nade, a Healthcharger and a Suitcharger in it. The AR2 and CB in the second hall are placed on a balcony, over watching the room.

The RPG in this map was designed hard to get while avoiding the use of “punishment” or timer systems; it is simply located at the end of a long underground hallway.
There are two ways to get to it: one is through a floor break inside the Supercharger room, the other is a ladder at the farther end of the hallway.
Two ways of getting out: one is the ladder and the other is prop-jumping back to the Supercharger room.
Unfortunately for the player choosing this option, the only prop available is a prison bed which is poor for prop jumping further enforcing the purpose of the RPG design.

The two far ends of the map appear to be mainly connected by the long L-Shaped hallway, however the available interconnections make it redundant, or the REAL “secondary route” if you will.
It does not contain any weapons / ammo you wouldn’t find elsewhere, apart perhaps from the one CB. Other than that, you will find in it frag grenades and a Crossbow.
All pickups in the L-shaped hallway are on its upper level, a Lockdown style catwalk.

Map Properties:

Player Spawn count - 17


Weapon count:

3 - Magnum
2 – AR2 riffle
4 – Crossbow
3 – Shotgun
1 – RPG
1 – SMG
15 – Frag Grenade


Ammo count:

1 – Ammo Crate (Frag Grenades)
1 – Ammo Crate (SMG ammo)
4 – Magnum Ammo
3 – AR2 Ammo
5 – Orb
2 – Crossbow Ammo
2 – Pistol Ammo
4 – SMG Ammo
6 – SMG Grenades
3 – Shotgun Ammo
1 – RPG Rounds


Pickup count:

10 – Armor
13 – Healthkit
2 - Healthvial
2 – Health Charger
2 – Suit Charger
1 – Super Charger


Prop count:

55 – Physic props
38 – Respawnable Physic props: both explosive barrels as well as wood crates

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I will be releasing the map primarily as a RC version to avoid renaming it as much as possible. Once the judges approve the current version I will post a DL link.

Thanks,
Valar

Very nice, well deserved! Can't wait for release!

Valar ur a fuckin tease, jk/

Valar ur a fuckin tease, jk/

Hey pern, wheres the ar.. its not respawning!

this deserved to win and it did, allelujah

looks very nice. Lockdown hax though with the ceilings lmao.

jerk

looks nice gj

we have gladius out to dl...i'm itching to play asylum....when it coming our way m8...

holy PM'd me saying there's already dm_asylum so we need a new name. i've made a poll with name options here. please go ahead and vote for the name you like best.
thanks,

dm_straitjacket?

dm_delirious
dm_cranky
dm_nutterz
dm_demented
dm_brainless
dm_insanity
dm_delirium

i like dm_delirious

http://www.hl2dm-university.com/forum/p ... f=5&t=5220
poll votes

I think dm_insane_asylum would be pretty cool, based on your description of the map.

Also, I thought dm_insanity was already taken...I could be wrong though. Regardless of the possible fact, F***ing amazing job on the map!!

thanks man.
let go and vote for a name guys. i would really love to move on with it.

i like thes 2
dm_hospice
dm_lost_plot

then vote
http://www.hl2dm-university.com/forum/p ... f=5&t=5220

then vote

Done!

This map makes me cum.... Nice work Valar!

p.s. i voted

Dm_Asylum is in last beta before release.
You're all invited to come in and provide your insights, inputs, ideas, crits and whatever if you think anything should be considered for the final version.

Download available here

The map is running 24-7 on my NY pure 1 server
ip: 208.167.247.106:27015
pswd: hl2dm

This is NOT THE FINAL VERSION. playing this on a pub is not advised. pub owners, please do not upload this to your servers. thanks!

Last note: first glance is nice and all but any serious input can only come from actual gameplay. if you're thinking of posting your inputs, your most welcome but please, do so after you've scrimed on it.

Thanks everybody.

Well whats the name of the map you early poll closing silly bastage?

it will remain as is - dm_asylum

MWHAHAHAHA

FYI. again i'm getting one type of inputs when personally playtesting with people and another when i'm not there. this is the feedback i got from the warfare arena last night.

Never tell your password to anyone.
Monday, July 26, 2010
5:42 AM - {EE}FRANK| R.I.P MIKE IN BOSTON: just to let you know..people are saying more weapons and that its wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy to big
6:24 AM - {EE}FRANK| R.I.P MIKE IN BOSTON: we just had 8 players in and it was pretty good...and more people said that they couldnt find weapons that it needed more

Map being "too big" can easily be remedied by a teleport and "needing more weapons" by simply placing more.
let's not let this turn into milieu #2 and get some serious feedback going. i think the map can turn out great IF people give proper feedbacks.

and thanks Frank.

I think a map this big should be tested on filled servers like verrues 91.121.36.8:27015 or anitalink etc (in Europe) and just spec gameplay. How bout spawn with 3 nades?

Hey Valar, I'm not sure because I explored the map for a short while in warfare, but talk to New Guy, he was giving some really good feedback. I think he was saying you should move the super charger and rpg so that the map would be a battle for either, so like if you were at super charger, you were risking giving someone else a chance at rpg. I THINK that's what he was getting at but i'm not sure, ask him. Other than that, i'd say more weapon spawns, please.

I finally had a chance to run around in it and here are my thoughts. I agree that the map needs more weapons and ammo. Mainly in some of the hallways. The map does seem big, but I think that it just has big rooms. Like the hallways and some of the rooms are just a lot larger then most maps being played right now. I think this is due to your L4D mapping . Each room is big enough to defend from the hoard lol. I like the map though and I think that it's not a bad thing to be the size it is. It will force teams to stick together more. Adding some more weps and ammo will help quite a bit though I think. I also agree with what New Guy said. You need to give the map "zones" like on Lockdown. Force teams to work certain areas so rooms on the map aren't forgettable. Only problem I had with the actual map was that I had trouble seeing a lot of the weapons. This might of just been me not looking hard enough, but I thought that there were times when I ran over a weapon and I never even saw it sitting there lol. All and all a real doozy of a map man.

I like the map's size too. My only complaints are similar, it needs just a few more weapons. I was also thinking it can be hard at times to find the enemy, is it possible to make make some sort of security video TV in some of the hallways where you could have vision of the bigger rooms or maybe a security video room in that balcony? Also if I had one more thing to say, maybe mark out the supercharger just a bit more? For basically something that can make/break a game maybe make the glow of the supercharger area a bit more marked or something of the sort.

I remember One Flew over the Cuckoos and all those security TV's everywhere that really add to the environment of a creepy hospital, but IDK sort of a ridiculous request to make.

*More weps/pickups - easy. i'm on it.

*To put an end to the "omg map is too big" thing.
I've made screenshots of LD and Asylum in Hammer using the exact same zoom value. the maps are COMPLETELY the same size. (same goes for ALL the ROOMS in both maps, Sacrifist ).


Think about Asylum as a LD cut in the middle and the bottom part pushed a bit to the side, making the general layout wider.
Hope this concludes the map size debate. Asylum is not bigger, its just brighter and ceilings are taller giving the illusion of larger spaces.

*Love the monitor idea. but the way this engine works is once a player is viewing an ingame camera showing a different part of the level he's in; the game will also render that other part as well as the part you're in at the time. In Source we occlude one area from another to keep frames playable therefore cams are killing performance because we've just stripped the map of all visual occlusion.
Note how in bio and LA swot is using a very low-res cam showing a nothing shot. e.g. what you see through those monitors are pretty much empty areas with no details at all, definitely not heavy traffic junctions, hallways, etc. this unfortunately cannot be worked around. cams are so fucked up in this engine that in fact if you took away the cams from LA, bio and infinity these maps would immediately gain anywhere between 15% to 25% MORE frames. it's that bad.
A possible solution: if you need to know if someone is in a certain room i can do that using indicator lights. i'll just need to know which areas need to be monitored and where the indicator lights should be placed. i'm not so sure this will really do what you're trying to get though.

*As for the supercharger - could you perhaps explain "mark" a bit more? as it is now: the supercharger has indicator lights in and outside the room and another light above the doorway on the L hallway coming into the supercharger area. so i'm not sure..

just realized something i didn't reckon with before.
i've gone through a lot of trouble removing weps / pickups from the path to prevent xbow shots getting caught in them. seems i've done a good job lol.. perhaps too good?

Another thing. during production i've gone through the entire map with Con after he pointed out the fact it needed something to pick up every few feet and we've made sure this rule it met.

So i think it might be best holding off on adding more weps/pickups for now until at least several people who learn the map come back with more solid feedbacks on the ACTUAL amount of wep/pickups in the map.

{EE}FRANK added it to both servers rotation now.

• I think I had a different experience while playing on Warfare Arena. That may be because I took time to locate weapons, items, etc. when checking out the map on Valar's server in the weeks prior. I think the map has plenty of weapons and stuff.
  
  There definitely is a more spacious feel and I like that. There are enough choke points and interesting areas to keep things going. Obviously it needs maybe 6 or more players to cook, but that's cool. When peeps started joining Warefare it cooked.
  
  I wasn't sure about that teleport in the vent shaft. Not a big deal. It's nice to have some indication that a tele is there. Oh, and I did get stuck on someone who was camping that little cubby where the info_teleport_destination is located. I'm pretty sure there is a push to help prevent that, but it happened anyway. Might have been bad timing on my part. xD
  
  I thought it was kinda weird that we could shoot rpg out of the center grating in the rpg area. I suppose that's intended to give rpg a chance to get out.

All in all, 'twas fun. Hope to play more of it soon.

Thanks for the input.

the teleport may or may not be there in the final version. i'm thinking if it does, it would be a different one taking you from one side of the map to the other. let's wait and see.

As for the rpg grate - unless requested otherwise - it will enable all bullets, missiles, nades through in finale version.

I think you should move the super charger to that huuuuuuuuuuge room with the balcony and the AR2 on the balcony, because we played a few matches on it and I felt it was too easy to charge up, drop down that hole to the rpg and be on your merry way, with 100/200.

would you put an AR2 and Orb right next to the supercharger in LD or Cav?

we will definaly use this map in this weeks draft. Please leave us a download link in the event forums so i can get it to everyone.

And as for the 'More weapons' thing, I think people said the same thing about cavs. And most maps until they really learn all of the spawns and the closest weapon.

From looking at that pic I think asylum might be a little larger than lockdown

I don't think it needs more weapons. And I just mean you should move the super charger to a different place, like i said, it's too easy to just drop down to rpg with 100/200.

did you play the map in a multiplayer situation?
reason i'm asking is because for one: the supercharger is located in a room that is pretty much impossible to defend. secondly, eventho the way IN to the RPG is easy, the way OUT isn't (long corridor and almost no shield at all).
let me know..

Many people will play the map competitively this weekend. Maybe just wait until we finish up the draft night on Sunday before coming to final conclusions, I'm sure there will be alot of advice after.

I have it as the semi final map. Those are generally decided by 10 or less points.

Yeah. I did. I played a 2v. And pubbed it a few times. I'm making it a habit to play every new map out, I've played this, vast, metalbase, etc. I still think yes, even though you have to go a long way to get out, you have an rpg that can go through the grate so you can get people up there, as well as having 100/200 possibly.

didnt had the chance to play it in a scrim but i rly love the map. one question, is it wanted that u can grab the rpg with ggun from the upper floor through the fence?

as i said on the CU forums - ANY and ALL bugs or issues will be addressed in the next version. i'm waiting for after this weekend to get some more feedbacks after the draft matches to do a comprehensive revision. keep you posted on the CU forums as well when i do.

I BTW tried very hard to grab the RPG through the bars and never made it but who knows with this engine lol.

http://rapidshare.com/files/409828750/asylum_rpg.dem

lol just found the tele

Valar;

Frankly the 3v3's on asylum_b6 didnt go well for draft. The map produced the lowest scoring 3v3 rounds since I can remember. Quite simply...

Hallways were too narrow, it was too easy to camp in RPG at the bottom, me and blas would sit there picking people off for almost 5 minutes straight, its almost impossible to retake the lower RPG if the camping person has good aim. The same complaint could be made for zeta but there are many more entrances to RPG to rush and retake it, there are only two for asylum, very small entrances you have to climb down or crouch into to retake the area. The time it takes to crouch or climb down to the area leads to an easy pick.

It was a little too big overall, opponents had trouble finding eachother, and by then most of us knew the map. IDK quite honestly I don't foresee it in league match 3v3 unless the size is reduced, and major revamps are done with the RPG area.

yea tried it out in the draft and can support what has been said. The map does feel big I still got lost even the second round but by that point I just choose to stick to a corner of the map, may need a bit of streamlining. What I did like was the weapon placements and overall feel of the map. When I saw the rpg placement I though it was a good idea with long tunnel being exposed on the top. But that was until I realised rpg can go through the grate plus as said if you got a good aim you can pick off targets on top.

will 1) teleporters throughout the map and 2) more access ways to RPG do it?

Edit: BTW how can the hallways be too narrow when they are 3 or more players wide?

will 1) teleporters throughout the map and 2) more access ways to RPG do it?

Edit: BTW how can the hallways be too narrow when they are 3 or more players wide?

I meant the upper hallways above the RPG. It's too easy to pick someone off from RPG area because of how narrow they are. It's almost insta kill because they have so little space to run around with.

Also teleporters throughout the map *may* help, but I think you just need to resize it IMO. Also more access ways into the RPG could help also, but perhaps widen the grates so I can't camp off to the sides of the RPG lower area without almost any risk to myself.

I do not understand your point at all valiums. If you have mag in the RPG area and ur just camping; well I mag you back, shoot bolts and bounce them since it's narrow and easy to do, or throw hand nades/orbs thru grate. You cant throw hand nades thru there right now but I believe valar's going to make it so you can in the final vers. Don't tell me you can't be magged back either like you know it for a fact.

I personally loved the way the map played, and how in the hell are low scores a bad thing??? The map gives you a lot of breathing room unlike almost any of the other comp maps these days.

And also since you're down on the bottom with a mag, well fuck I'll just come down there from the entrance that's right by the RPG spawn and attack you that way! And it's not like the people HAVE to try and kill you down in RPG area either lol, hell I'll just go charge up some 200 get orbs and smg nades and play it slow.

One thing I guess I could see doing is making it so everything can go through that grate except RPG, players and physics? If that's possible

i just talked with valar about the same issue, that itsb a low frag map. as we in euro have homemaps, barely no team would take this map as a homemap. reason is... when u face an opponent with a high frag map like overwatch or octagon you never have the chance to win the match overall. he make 40+ fags on his map and you make 20+ frags max on your map. bcs the map feels big and a lots of places to hide and to run away.

but i dont have a clue how to edit the map so it fits.

besides that i dont think the rpg area should be changed. there are 3 entries to the rpg and like constipator said, when ppl are camping down there just fully load and spam with balls, there are enough in the map. only think i would change is the floor over the rpg. dunno how to say in english but u can shoot from rpg under the upper floor and player will get killed. that should be changed

what i see is controversy. and it's not the first time i'm seeing it regarding this map.
what i think should be done is the competition organizers, like in previous years, should see the map through until it's reached a desirable state.
i don't believe there can be a one version that will please all but most definitely we can fix the major problems and fine tune the others.

My thoughts at this stage (please comment):

1) map size. i don't honestly see how we can remove 30-50% of the map without basically ruining it. on the other hand, a system of teleports can be easily done. this will make the map a lot faster to move through and essentially smaller.
2) RPG - the initial idea with the RPG was while you still have an RPG in the map it's not as dominating as it is in other maps. that idea failed because it was poorly executed (the grate issue) so the question is:
do we keep the original idea and make it work or - we can choose to open the RPG, adding more access routes to it.
regarding the grate: having players and physics go through the grate you might as well simply remove the grate altogether. i'm not against the idea, just clarifying. is this something you'd like to see?

i just talked with valar about the same issue, that itsb a low frag map. as we in euro have homemaps, barely no team would take this map as a homemap. reason is... when u face an opponent with a high frag map like overwatch or octagon you never have the chance to win the match overall. he make 40+ fags on his map and you make 20+ frags max on your map. bcs the map feels big and a lots of places to hide and to run away.

No matter what you do to this map it won't be high scoring map like bio and I don't see how that should be the mapper's problem. It just means that CU system on the overall winner just limits the map that would be used in league by the teams. It does not mean at all that it is not a good map or suited to competitive play. Just saying

1) map size. i don't honestly see how we can remove 30-50% of the map without basically ruining it. on the other hand, a system of teleports can be easily done. this will make the map a lot faster to move through and essentially smaller.
2) RPG - the initial idea with the RPG was while you still have an RPG in the map it's not as dominating as it is in other maps. that idea failed because it was poorly executed (the grate issue) so the question is:
do we keep the original idea and make it work or - we can choose to open the RPG, adding more access routes to it.
regarding the grate: having players and physics go through the grate you might as well simply remove the grate altogether. i'm not against the idea, just clarifying. is this something you'd like to see?

I don't think you will have to remove 30-50% more like 20% should do it. What I found was when playing it was that most of the action what taking place in the prison hall and away from that giant hall. May be try and trim away areas that see less action and try and focus around the prison halls. I do like the map for it breathing room but it so easy to sneak up on people especially with no sound when bhopping.

On rpg don't remove the grate good thing about the grate is that is forces you down a channel to get the rpg rather than just dropping onto it. But if you want to increase access to the lower tunnel I suggest you make a small hole in the grate to fall through in the second grate away from rpg. As well it either make it so both rpg and grenades can go through grate or not at all like caverns.

then removing areas that don't see as much action means removing the whole supercharger area and surrounding rooms. which is, again, half the map.

Well I'm just speaking from my own experience. In the RPG area there is a connector of solid cover ceiling, the area between the two grates where no one could get me and I had the RPG BTW. I had vision of the ladder, vision of the jammed doorway and just barely enough vision of the last end of the grates on the upper floor to shoot upwards.

When I camped there I didn't die once for over 5 minutes. I shot one person trying to climb down the ladder with RPG, shot one person two times trying to crawl through the jammed doorway and did not encounter any effective SMG nade use that could get near me camping in this spot.

IDK we had 7 players in the server that night (one spec), not a single person wanted to a second round on it. I think it needs something, but as it stands its not going to be a map chosen by anybody at this point because we also found it to be low scoring and boring.

there's a supercharger?

Take out the RPG and all but one shotty. That would be cool.

Well I'm just speaking from my own experience. In the RPG area there is a connector of solid cover ceiling, the area between the two grates where no one could get me and I had the RPG BTW. I had vision of the ladder, vision of the jammed doorway and just barely enough vision of the last end of the grates on the upper floor to shoot upwards.

When I camped there I didn't die once for over 5 minutes. I shot one person trying to climb down the ladder with RPG, shot one person two times trying to crawl through the jammed doorway and did not encounter any effective SMG nade use that could get near me camping in this spot.

IDK we had 7 players in the server that night (one spec), not a single person wanted to a second round on it. I think it needs something, but as it stands its not going to be a map chosen by anybody at this point because we also found it to be low scoring and boring.

I'm sorry but i just don't get it. first you gave the map 1st place at the competition you hosted, then you praised it here and on the CU forums to no end. But then, you play one real match on it and all of a sudden you bury it without second thought. wouldn't it make more sense to give some more serious constructive suggestions instead of this once over?
I don't mean no disrespect but i just don't see the competition board being professional about it. You wanted new competitive maps and you've found the one you guys felt it was the best. now, it's time to fine tune things. No winning map has EVER released without constructive help. None. I shouldn't be running after the board for inputs for 2 weeks and then get this. That's just wrong.
I'm sorry for getting all like that but this is exactly what i was worried will eventually happen. and it did.

I would not get too upset about what Valium said he just being honest and giving feed back on how everyone else felt about the map. I think walking around a map and having a close look by even a experience gamer would not give a idea on how well it would play out in a match. speaking more my self I do like it I found the breathing space quite refreshing to collect my self and then go on hunting and making my way to places of action.

I list what I think can be improved as said it just need streamlining no drastic changes.
1. As valium said there is a blind spot in the tunnel. You could solve thing by connecting the two grates as just on long curved grate. (keep in mind I am not a mapper not a clue how easy this can be done)
2. Make it so no rpg or even grenades can go through the grate. I have changed my mind on this since I believe this will give incentive for the player to get out of the tunnel to use rpg. Plus looking at the grate it makes sense that a rocket should not go through it.
3. Add a hole in the second grate as mentioned in my previous post.
4. working on this one....

Problem with this map is it is complex and it does take time for players know their way around a map. hl2dm players are too used to simple big open spaced maps. give it time.

I got upset because of the time invested. those who aren't mapping can't understand and that's fine. but to answer you:
I welcome honest criticism. however criticism that states faults and doesn't offer solutions isn't productive or constructive.
I'm good with giving it time as i think others should too, but repeatably stating "no one is going to play this map ...it's boring" isn't really gonna help it stay around long enough to be picked up.

1. As valium said there is a blind spot in the tunnel. You could solve thing by connecting the two grates as just on long curved grate. (keep in mind I am not a mapper not a clue how easy this can be done)

doable.

2. Make it so no rpg or even grenades can go through the grate. I have changed my mind on this since I believe this will give incentive for the player to get out of the tunnel to use rpg. Plus looking at the grate it makes sense that a rocket should not go through it.

doable. note nothing else will too. including bullets - game restrictions prevent me from filtering RPGs from bullets from nades, etc.

3. Add a hole in the second grate as mentioned in my previous post.

doable.

Problem with this map is it is complex

I disagree. Airfusion is far more complex. i think it's something else here, but as of yet i'm just not sure what.
what this needs is

Its begging to be 3v3'ed the f*ck out of.

Well I'm not a mapper. I'm a strictly competitive player, I can offer advice in the way of how it played, but as a non-mapper I can't really give suggestions on how you can fix them. I did advocate the map to be played, but now that its been played it didnt pan out as well as the map ran when we did loose scrims with no serious consequences to them. I also disagree with airfusion being more complex, the map is almost entirely in the open, you have vision of your opponents almost at all times during scrims/league matches. With this map so far the vision is not there, its more of a guessing game where they are and where you guess they are I found the opponents where never there, thus the low scoring.

If you're going to get snarky or can't handle my critiques, fine, I won't offer them anymore.

Everyone take a deep breath. Valium, you can still give him some feedback from a competitive player's perspective. Get with him and do a walk through again now that you have played it in a competitive situation. I dont think one round during the draft is really enough to consider the map dead. You have to realize that players are not familiar with the map still. Im sure Valar will need to make changes, but you guys should really give this one a chance to grow and work with Valar to make the map more streamline to a competitors liking. He can make 95% of the changes that have been mentioned in this thread if need be. No need to go calling the map a failure yet.

I don't see this

I don't mean no disrespect

I'm sorry for getting all like that but this is exactly what i was worried will eventually happen. and it did.

I got upset because of the time invested

as being snarky or can't handle critiques.
I need constructive criticism not rating.
As an admin you should be able to handle someone being honest. In all previous mapping competitions the judges, AFTER calling the winners, went ahead and made sure all issues and bugs were fixed and ONLY then released the map to the public. This is what i was waiting for and the reason for my ranting.
Now, as i've asked in previous posts and as Sacrifist suggest - work with me on how to fix what is not working.
Your call.

doable. note nothing else will too. including bullets - game restrictions prevent me from filtering RPGs from bullets from nades, etc.

ahh now i see why it's so problematic. So it not individual bars the game treats it as a mesh. Okay now I understand if you prevent rpg you have to stop bullets, well in that case leave it as it is by preventing bullets and no way to shot the guy in the tunnel there is nothing to prevent a team from gaining a lead and then camping in the tunnel covering all exits seeing out the rest of the game. I do find this strange I swear there are maps with grates that allow bullets but not rpg emm octagon springs to mind near the pipes ar2.

On the map being complex it is I would compare it to powerhouse which is a in door environment which does take time to know the layout of the map. Reason why I said it is complex is that you got three levels in the map the tunnel,ground floor, then 1st floor as well the you got small rooms that fairly close together as well as interconnecting corridors. Problem is a player can end up circulating in a loop if you miss a exit which is what happened to me in 1st round.

what would help is to post a top down view of the map and please label out key point of importance like rpg, chargers, and teleporters. From there I and other would have a better idea of the layout of the map and see what can be done to improve the map.

I need to try something. the grate is currently a mesh (displacement). perhaps by turning it to brushes it may let bullets through but not physics, rpg and nades which is what i understand we're looking for.

the mesh in biohazard comes into mind



to prevent all this rpg camping i suggest several buttons in the map which will start a timer and a sound. after 15sec all players in rpg level will die (gas/explosion/etc.).
so a person who want to have rpg will have to come out of there.

I used the term "mesh" as to describe the entity in Hammer - Displacement, as oppose to Brush - a Solid.
The RPG shooting through the grate is fixed by creating the grate from brushes instead of a displacement. once this is done the rule regarding the shoot-through metal grate / bars texture will set in and nothing else will go through besides bullets.
This will reinstate the original idea where once you've gone down to get the RPG you will have to get out since you can be shot at from above. You can of course shoot back but anyone risking going down there doesn't do so just to have a shoot out at a disadvantage point.

Back to the topic of map size:

There are several ways in which you can cut down size or work around it but at this point i'm far from certain this is even called for.
I'll blow it up so it will be clear
You cannot judge a map after only one match. get real.

LD were it presented today as a new map would've been utterly trashed by these "standards".

(take the rpg off altogether and lose the bottom)

dm_asylum
and
dm_asylum_rpg

no?

Sister versions never get caught on and i don't believe this case warrants it.
Let's concentrate on constructive feedbacks.
I will release a b7 in the next few days. in the meantime and onward, those who want new maps are welcome to keep playing the map so we can get more information. this is valuable.
The ongoing thread sort of turned the focus in the wrong direction and i want to put it back on track - This is a beta! It needs playtesting.

this is so rediculas. i can understand complaints about weapon/charger placement because of camping but to say the map is "too big" is just crazy. to take a beautiful map like this and chop it up just so the never happy hl2dm community can use it for high scoring "i want tons of frags to show off in SS's" league play matches is pathetic. ive played and seen a ton of hockey games that were 2-1 or even 1-0 that were incredibly intense and fun. the ppl that hate games like that are the ppl that dont truly understand the sport and the dedication to mastering the skills of winning the little battles that result in scoring chances, even if the puck doesnt go in. this community DOES understand the finer points of the game and should be open to maps that push these things. when you know you are playing a deffensive "trap" style team, you adjust your play and know going into the match that its not going to be high scoring and that every scoring opportunity has to be capatilized on. my point is, whats wrong with having a map like this that alters your playing mindset. having a variety of map layouts makes for a wide range of game results. keeps the league fun. instead of adjusting to a new map accordingly, its easier to bitch and whine that it doesnt fit the cookie cutter mold. then to push Valar to spend more countless hours away from his family to try and cater to the lazy complainers who in the end will just say, fuck it, lets just put the same map we have been playing for years in is wrong. Val, instead of redoing the map, just put up a wall that cuts off 1/3 of the map and write "is it small enough now bitches?" on it.

chem u are definately ON IT my man well said

this is so rediculas. i can understand complaints about weapon/charger placement because of camping but to say the map is "too big" is just crazy. to take a beautiful map like this and chop it up just so the never happy hl2dm community can use it for high scoring "i want tons of frags to show off in SS's" league play matches is pathetic. ive played and seen a ton of hockey games that were 2-1 or even 1-0 that were incredibly intense and fun. the ppl that hate games like that are the ppl that dont truly understand the sport and

Usually I agree with the things you say Chem, but all this talk from a person who AFAIK doesnt even play hl2dm anymore, nor did you even try this in a match yet. Why don't you actually try it in a real match before you talk about it. There can be low scoring maps that can be intense, but this map did not draw any feeling of intensity for any of us that match. There were no areas that any of us felt drawn to dominate, the opposing team didnt even need to come kill me at RPG, they just stayed away and won anyway without the RPG. Typically in RPG maps you should feel compelled to dominate or retake the RPG area but the map was so big there was no need to.

I hope b7 is released before the next draft starts,maybe you can join us to actually see what we're talking about.

this is so rediculas. i can understand complaints about weapon/charger placement because of camping but to say the map is "too big" is just crazy. to take a beautiful map like this and chop it up just so the never happy hl2dm community can use it for high scoring "i want tons of frags to show off in SS's" league play matches is pathetic. ive played and seen a ton of hockey games that were 2-1 or even 1-0 that were incredibly intense and fun. the ppl that hate games like that are the ppl that dont truly understand the sport and

Usually I agree with the things you say Chem, but all this talk from a person who AFAIK doesnt even play hl2dm anymore, nor did you even try this in a match yet. Why don't you actually try it in a real match before you talk about it. There can be low scoring maps that can be intense, but this map did not draw any feeling of intensity for any of us that match. There were no areas that any of us felt drawn to dominate, the opposing team didnt even need to come kill me at RPG, they just stayed away and won anyway without the RPG. Typically in RPG maps you should feel compelled to dominate or retake the RPG area but the map was so big there was no need to.

I hope b7 is released before the next draft starts,maybe you can join us to actually see what we're talking about.

wasnt a shot at you Val. and yes, you are correct in saying i dont play much any more. prolly 45 mins in the last 7-8 months. i took a break cause i was taking programming classes and just didnt have the time. now i have just been into other games. BUT with that said, i love this community and would never just totally take off. ill get back into playing at some point. the game is one thing, and the ppl here are another. i have a lot of close friends here and care about a lot of ppl. valar is a very close friend of mine and it just drives me insane when he gets shit on. he submits a map to the contest, gets first place and tons of praise then after one week of draft he gets a bomb dropped on him. im not gonna go into this schpeel again, we have all heard it. and this isnt just about valar, its about everybody that tries to do something for the community and gets the shit end of the stick. take dallas for instance, he tried to run a league for us and got nothing but headaches. we distroyed CAL, yes i know it disbanning was out of our hands but in all seriousness that was just like somebody dropping a missle on the titanic an hour after it started sinking. holy is trying to put together a league and has to spend countless hours researching hacks because we cant even be honest with each other. is gotten to the point where its more than "this is why we cant have nice things". we almost at the "this is why we cant have anything". whatever, i have to go to work and really dont feel like pointing out more examples, we all konw what they are anyway.

I don't know why you brought up all that other stuff this is about Aslyum_b6...

Play the map and come back with advice, preaching about a map you havent played yet shouldnt be done with something as serious as beta testing for Valar unless you've actually played it.

with something as serious as beta testing for Valar.

do you honestly believe people are stupid and don't get your condescension?
no one shoved asylum down your throat man, You chose it and then shot yourself in the foot. deal with it.

I don't know why you brought up all that other stuff

If you don't know - ask. Don't ask and answer yourself.

with something as serious as beta testing for Valar.

do you honestly believe people are stupid and don't get your condescension?
no one shoved asylum down your throat man, You chose it and then shot yourself in the foot. deal with it.

I don't know why you brought up all that other stuff

If you don't know - ask. Don't ask and answer yourself.

This is supposed to be a thread about your map, not about BS from the past that happened years ago. Nonetheless I'm done with helping out since every post I make gets sniped at from you, I'd rather devote time into something/someone else. Maybe the 20 some people that played it that night can help you out, but no one seems to be posting here after we played that night besides SND.

did you actually sit and READ your own posts BEFORE posting?


edit: and nvm that, if this is a thread about my map and you being the host of the mapping competition how come you haven't posted not one single suggestion?
with so much play time behind you you must be able to come up with more than "no one will pick this map for league" and "it's boring".
Yeah i'm all up for discussing the map. did you count the times i've asked you for ideas?
this is BS man. that's all. you wanna work - let's work.

this is so rediculas. i can understand complaints about weapon/charger placement because of camping but to say the map is "too big" is just crazy. to take a beautiful map like this and chop it up just so the never happy hl2dm community can use it for high scoring "i want tons of frags to show off in SS's" league play matches is pathetic. ive played and seen a ton of hockey games that were 2-1 or even 1-0 that were incredibly intense and fun. the ppl that hate games like that are the ppl that dont truly understand the sport and

Usually I agree with the things you say Chem, but all this talk from a person who AFAIK doesnt even play hl2dm anymore, nor did you even try this in a match yet. Why don't you actually try it in a real match before you talk about it. There can be low scoring maps that can be intense, but this map did not draw any feeling of intensity for any of us that match. There were no areas that any of us felt drawn to dominate, the opposing team didnt even need to come kill me at RPG, they just stayed away and won anyway without the RPG. Typically in RPG maps you should feel compelled to dominate or retake the RPG area but the map was so big there was no need to.

I hope b7 is released before the next draft starts,maybe you can join us to actually see what we're talking about.

you had one round that was low, and the next was a little below average. If you are winning in powerhouse and lose the rpg, you don't need to goto rpg


I don't get the stance you are taking, you know Valar is willing to work with anyone to improve his maps. He can't just throw in the towel and say it's to big though, that thought really got to valar. I know I get pissed when i spent a lot of time working on something and someone comes along and just says what i spent months on is shit and I should give up.

Con played it and also posted thoughts on the map btw.

People just don't want to give it a shot because it's not super simple in design like caverns IMO. I mean, they actually asked him to DELETE some of his map to be smaller and "easier to navigate"....lol. Amplitude literally took me weeks to learn back in the day because of its maze-like design; this should be a good thing that you don't know it completely after just one match. This is, to me, how maps in this game should be.

I would change the grate to be like people have suggested and put it in Sunday's draft night again. Change+play this fucker 'till it feels right.

you had one round that was low, and the next was a little below average. If you are winning in powerhouse and lose the rpg, you don't need to goto rpg


I don't get the stance you are taking, you know Valar is willing to work with anyone to improve his maps. He can't just throw in the towel and say it's to big though, that thought really got to valar. I know I get pissed when i spent a lot of time working on something and someone comes along and just says what i spent months on is shit and I should give up.

Con played it and also posted thoughts on the map btw.

The second round you saw was caverns, we had a unaminous vote of 6-0 to not play it a second round. My anger was partly directed at the 10+ people who complained to me that night of how bad it played yet no one else is here offering advice of why they thought it was bad.

Part of my critique was echoing the sentiments of these ten people, too campish in many areas, low scoring, RPG was too easy hold ect. Like I said though I'm done giving advice, if no one else is going to come and try to offer advice and consti is the one advocating leaving the map basically as it is minus the grate change then leave the map as it is and be done ^^

I did a few scrims on it, it is now one of my favorite map to scrim. I love it cause this map (and ethic) i get like 35 fps (10 fps more than usual) and theres a lot of flow in the map. IDK why people complain about it, its not THAT big, its perfect in my opinion. And if people are annoying by the rpg thing, maybe you could make a normal asylum and a rpg one but idk. People were complain about the lack of kills in a scrims?

49 - 59 seems ok no?

New version up. lots of changes, revamps and bug fixes all aimed at making the map faster and able to produce higher scores in matches.

Main changes:

- RPG level is gone. RPG moved to the dome hall. press the panel switch on the balcony. wait 10 sec. RPG drops down from center of the dome. system resets after 1 minute.
- TV monitors around the map show 60 sec countdown to when RPG is available again.
- Opened another fast route from showers to dome hall to help balancing the RPG control.
- The AR2 previously on the balcony has moved over to the showers.
- Showers Shotty moved to the entrance to boiler room (next to dome hall)
- Boiler room expanded
- Supercharger rearranged
- Connection behind supercharger area blocked now
- Added Supercharger status lights on more spots around the map
- Removed main wall from the white room before the showers
- All ladders removed from the long hallway. Instead, there are now ramps.
- The 2 gates in long hallway are now unsolid to props and ballistics. if anything was stopping you from banking xbows - now you can.
- Added decals marking player spawns to help ppl get oriented and learn the spawns easily.
__________________

I want to thank The New Guy and bLur who both helped out so much. for their time and attention to details.
I want to also thank VitaminG, koncentrate, Herb, Grain and others who dropped some valuable gameplay inputs this time round or just came in for a playtest.

Download Here
Drop by my server, map is running alone on a pure, 20 min rounds 8 slots in NJ, NY.
ip: 208.167.247.106:27015
pswd: hl2dm

* We will soon have a demo vid up to get people more acquainted with Asylum so stay tuned for that.
* Remember this is still in beta phase so anything and everything is still opened - hit me up with your inputs if you gott'em.

This map now sounds like a map I'll be playing. Will be trying it out very soon and will use it in next draft, sounds like some great work was done.

here is a demo of how it played in 2v2 http://www.filefront.com/17188844/asylumbat1.dem
i'ts kinda short cause i crashed pretty early on but, it has some good frags

i like how you solved the rpg-"situation" 1 min respawntime is good imo, so it wont be a never ending rpg spam
i dont like the spawn-decals. think teams should make the effort to learn spawn-places (just bcs i did ) hope they will be removed for the final version.
and one thing i noticed was that there is a lot of health and suit surrounding the rpg-room. cant say how that effects gameplay, but its just a lot

good work imo, even though i have to test it in scrim first.


(yay you followed the two of my advices )

player spawn marks are there only for the beta period.
the too much health around the RPG...guess we'll see during real matches.
BTW thanks blas for the demo. i'd really love to see some more - this REALLY helps out a lot...you or anybody else.

Link

there you go.

here's a 2v2 scrim i got from nervous
2v2asylumb8.dem

Wow, very nice walkthrough. I specially like the fastladders.

I just played a 1 round match on it and it went pretty well, have to play it some more. The walkthrough will definitely help, thanks!

Just ran around B8 Valar. Nice work. A few notes (without screenies because it's Friday and I must do some stuff). In the shower room, there is a crate
which is halfway melted into one of the benches.
Also, I don't like that the benches have collisions turned off. I would put player clips(like over the lockers) so you feel like they are there, but don't impede.
Next, the target decals......Many of them disappear into the walls a bit. Could use some tweaking.
And the sprite plants.... They just seem to be unnecessary. As you pass a few of them, they rotate unrealistically into the walls and half way disappear.The map would not suffer a tick without them.
And, in the shower room, and the other big hall, I feel like there is some z-axis which could be taken advantage of, but again, that is just my opinion.
And finally, there is a second floor with a bunch of doors on either side. This whole corridor seems a bit anti-climactic. I was walking around and I remembered some old comedy movies where they were chasing each other through many doors in a hallway and where they would come out did'nt make any sense(http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/ ... &FORM=LKVR, but it was funny(I know the video was a poor choice, but you have no idea how hard it was to find an example!). How about a series of teleporters which would accomplish the same thing? Could add some flavor to that area.
This map is, as are all of your maps, stellar, and with a little tweaking could be freaking awesome. Remember, I bow to your mapping skillz, so don't be upset by my opinions, because that's all they are.
I would play this as is anywho!.
Looking forward to B9, or even final!.

that's fine man. i always appreciate your notes. however keep in mind this map is not necessarily a pub and is focused on competitive more than ffa, as such there are some excruciating tradeoffs .
all is different not in b9 apart from the "second floor with a bunch of doors on either side" which i assume you're referring to the curved hallway. firstly, it doesn't need to be climactic it needs to follow a simple function and that is to connect the two parts of the map as fast and efficient as possible. if you're referring to its visual aspect, then i'm more than opened to suggestion - please, feel free hitting me with your ideas.
also, z axis i can take advantage of in the RPG and Locker rooms - how so? you don't explain.

thanks for posting and taking the time man!

hi there..

played b8 today.. nice thing

i like the countdown monitors, even when i don´t like rpg..
very nice destroyed lookin stuff all over, that dome is awesome aswell..

just found one displacement, textured with a nature.
(can´t remember which room. maybe it was showers)
those plants was hanging in the air.. no big thing i guess

pretty nice map... gonna try b9 when available

regards

those plants was hanging in the air.. no big thing i guess

its in the dome room

b9 download available
'ill edit the post to list all the changes and hopefully with a new vid.

also on
ip: 208.167.247.106:27015
pswd: hl2dm

if you're referring to its visual aspect, then i'm more than opened to suggestion - please, feel free hitting me with your ideas.

How much room you got behind those doors or the walls there I guess?

i'm lost?

The RPG-ammo hazard did not work.
I hit the switch the purposefully tried to go into the fan; I got sucked up and stayed against the fan for about two seconds but did not die.
And the shadows you were going for did not work either
Granted I only tested it once, it still will need some tweaking, however the concept turned out a lot better than I originally anticipated; it's just a bit buggy at the moment.

I still think the maximum number of indestructible props should stay at 7.
With that at 7, the number of volatile (explosive) props should be 5-9, as well as the non-volatile should be in the 5-9 range.
Considering how big and drawn out this map is, both of the indestructible prop values should be more 7-9.

This map has a good original theme that seems to be an amalgamation of caverns' RPG vs SC and lockdown-like aesthetics, only Valar seems to want both sides to be balanced in terms of weapons and spam. Combine that with Blur's idea of making the armor and health on the RPG side harder to gather, and thereby making the RPG harder to camp, and I think we will have a very nice competitive teamplay map.
Too bad the game is dead and broken.
Since Valar seems to be making a map that has the resources, weapons, and props split down the middle, the indestructible props placement should slightly lean toward the SC side to balance the 300hp opportunity, and the volatiles should lean toward the RPG side furthering the idea of it being hard to camp and control. By "slightly" I mean to suggest the SC side have 4 props, 4 barrels, and 5 boxes, whereas the RPG side have 3 props, 5 barrels, and 4 boxes.

I really hope you decide to stay within those ranges, Valar, and if people say an area is too "barren" you try rearranging prop-placement rather than shoving more in there.
If people say an area "looks" barren and "empty" I am sure you can conjure-up some spectacular eye-wonder that does not interfere with game-play.
This map is now loaded with weapons; the 3 mags and 4 bows do raise and eyebrow but are balanced on both sides, and this makes the map much more viable for a 4v4.
The room where you added the 4th bow may need its ceiling raised to make the room 35-50% taller; I foresee vertical combat being awkward, but that remains to be seen.
The 5 orbs work, if blast wants more I'll fucking stab him.

All of this needs a fuckload of playtesting though, and whatever the overwhelming ideas turn out to be are the ones you will have to defer to and accommodate, Valar.
It's still an awesome map, well done once again.

RPG ammo hazard - i've already seen that with edge yesterday. i knw how to fix it but i'll save that to the next version - which (!!!):

I want to solidify if amount of weapons and physic props is working - this can only be done by playing the map.
If possible please play it on draft and to outside-of-the-league scrims because that would help nailing everything in a matter of days.

the two most important things to put to the test are now:

1) high scoring -

2) weapons / pickups balance -
rest is secondary. (don't worry about barren areas, if any should seem so - that's the last thing to worry about.)

Also, Thanks a LOT and again to TNG and bLur. TNG actually spent hours and hours working on polishing stuff, raising ideas and suggesting changes, etc. and that to me is pretty amazing. so thanks so much! (boshed said it before and i'll say it again - the guy knows his stuff and would be a tremendous upgrade to any map design project.)

The 5 orbs work

so far i only found 4
- long corridor
- showers
- where the rpg ammo is
- in the small corridor where the 2 nade-boxes are
- ?

The Blur-orb.
It is in the RPG control area.
Start to head up the RPG stairs, then turn completely around, look down the corridor that has two nades, now look up and keep and eye out for a battery.
The orb is to the right of that battery, above your head, and you have to ggun it down.

The Blur-orb.
It is in the RPG control area.
Start to head up the RPG stairs, then turn completely around, look down the corridor that has two nades, now look up and keep and eye out for a battery.
The orb is to the right of that battery, above your head, and you have to ggun it down.

thx

The 5 orbs work

so far i only found 4
- long corridor
- showers
- where the rpg ammo is
- in the small corridor where the 2 nade-boxes are
- ?

For the RPG room Orb - Look at 6:40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBZWyxEjr20

For the (new) RPG ammo room - Look at 0:45 (instead of a teleport you now go into a fan room [like LD's only sexier]).

Weekend again - Draftnight on Sunday. any plans on play(test)ing Asylum you so love and want finished?

Weekend again - Draftnight on Sunday. any plans on play(test)ing Asylum you so love and want finished?

Yes, actually. I was talking with Impala last night and we both agreed that asylum should be one of the maps in this weekends draft.

I'm a draft admin, by the way.

Hell and Yes. Asylum is ON!

is it possible to make the rpg sound already when you press the button to release the rpg and not when its already dropping down?
(also: what does the voice say when the rpg drops down?)

is it possible to make the rpg sound already when you press the button to release the rpg and not when its already dropping down?
(also: what does the voice say when the rpg drops down?)

Medication something.

It says "Medication Time"

any inputs from last Sunday draft matches?

The orb + smg-nade in the ceiling at the RPG's (or bathroom) Ar2 had a hard time coming down; it would not fall from a grenade and was only able to be accessed when grainy shot the orb with his Ar2 several times. No one was able get the smg-nade from there at all in the short play testing session we had.

Anyone else encountering this difficulty?

The orb + smg-nade in the ceiling at the RPG's (or bathroom) Ar2 had a hard time coming down; it would not fall from a grenade and was only able to be accessed when grainy shot the orb with his Ar2 several times. No one was able get the smg-nade from there at all in the short play testing session we had.

Anyone else encountering this difficulty?

Yeah I remembered when I played the map locally it came down with a single pistol shot but it didn't at all when playing on a server.

As for draft night feedback, it played well. I dont have the screenshots with me though. Its quite the fun team map. I dont know if any of the other teams played a full round on it though. Last draft night kind of fell apart

This

The orb + smg-nade in the ceiling Ar2 had a hard time coming down

and this

The RPG-ammo hazard did not work.

will be fixed in next version. i'll be holding off releasing a new version till more feedbacks come in from next Draftnight.
thanks guys.

Yeah I'm not sure when the next draft night is. Certainly not this weekend.

aw...that dying too now hu?

Just until Nino gets his shit fixed. He mentioned something about having issues with the game..

da1's asked me about the next version so i want to clarify
i will have to wait until at least one most serious run has been done on the map to release a new version.
were there games last night or has draftnight halted?

the dl linkis down, can you upload it again?

idk whats the latest version, but i uploaded b8 version

DL via Rapidshare
DL via MegaUpload
DL via Uploaded.to

we're at b9. not b8
http://eyeclan.net/eyeden/hl2mp/maps/dm ... b9.bsp.bz2

rc1 will release in the next few days.

is it possible to make the rpg sound already when you press the button to release the rpg and not when its already dropping down?
(also: what does the voice say when the rpg drops down?)

the second you push the switch a beeping sound emits throughout the map so there is very clear indication to when someone is about the get the RPG.

are there any other inputs before i release rc1?

oh didnt know. looks really awesome now!
the vent to rpg ammo crate is little bit strange. its hard to crawl out, but going in is no problem.

this looks a bit odd:

New version up RC1
Download HERE

Play Here 208.167.247.106:27015
PSWD: hl2dm

Awesome! Checkin it out and putting it up on the efps site tonight!

Since Da1 asked; new version without the spawn markings - RC2
Download HERE

Play Here 208.167.247.106:27015
PSWD: hl2dm

zomfg 7 pages, whats the mod percentage of this map, geez.. was it worth it?

Probably worth less than your priceless post

Since Da1 asked; new version without the spawn markings - RC2
Download HERE

What the fucking cunt-shit?

Marking the spawns visible is the best and FASTEST way to get feedback on them, and it makes it easier for people, who are already resistant to change, to learn the NEW map.

But sure, right, yeah.
Make it harder for new players and old-schoolers alike to get up to speed on this map.

But sure, right, yeah.
Make it so you have to no-life and practice a map in order to learn the spawns and nuances and see how much more growth this game will experience; we all know no growth will happen whatsoever, but digging the hole even deeper just does not make sense.

But sure, right, yeah.
Slow down both the process of this map getting better as well as players getting better at it .

Should work. Yeah. Sure. Right.

Fuck.

Yep, you guessed it: spawn markings were my idea.
Just made sense to have them in front of you in order to see and analyze them rather than having to open up hammer to get a broad/objective look at them and how they should be placed.

It would have made the feedback on Boshed's Helix go MUCH faster with the judges just needing to "map dm_helix" it rather than play a scrim or suicide a lot and hope the randomizer BS got them to every spawn-point within a reasonable amount of time.

Saves time and is more effective.

But what do I know?

Fuck.

ppl can still DL the previous ver here
it has the spawn markers in it

Texas still blows. Hard.

So your saying have spawn markings in a league version of the map!? ya right, so people can just spawn camp them like crazy, makes a lot of sense. Not. Sure it was good for testing, but when it gets put in a league it is no longer in test mode.

So no one camps spawns in caverns, lockdown, or lostarena?
*Ahem* - "Not."

Clearly you have not played huge nerds such as TLC and Poor_Billy as much as I thought you have; either that, or you wore that cute fitted hat a bit too low on your brow when you play/scrim and are unable to see wtf is happening right in front of you.

Spawn camping is not wrong, for it is deathmatch. People did it in q3; people do it in this much less balanced POS game.
Thing is, in LD and LA you cant have line of sight to a whole lot of spawn points at one time.
I am not saying their spawns are perfect, but they are pretty good considering what is there to work with.

I have no expertise on spawn points.
If I did I would rant about it like i do everything else with an authoritative attitude.
It's the 'roids that Alex says I am on, I guess.

But I did tell Valar to put the icons on the map in order to speed up feedback on them.
Feedback from intelligent competitive-oriented people like Ko-Tao. As well as people that know some kind of shit on the subject, but also others who potentially could have very valid input but do not want to open hammer or nerd-practice the map.
I also told Valar that the competitive community would likely cry foul at the idea, and he may need to take them out.
And it seems you/they did, and so Valar was forced to abide.

Oh, and by-the-way, so long as a mapper is still around, a map is always in "test" stages.
People will continue to argue about this map. Then they will come to a collective decision and opportunities will be there for Valar to improve upon his map.

With that precedent, let me make my case:

The reason I am arguing to keep the markings in the map is so that nerd-ing/nolife-ing is not rewarded with bow kills on spawn points. The locations of spawn points is inforamtion that should be disclosed to every single player as fast as possible, for it levels the playing field (albeit very slightly) for everyone involved.

It's basic shit, these spawn points.
Why should teams have to put in extra hours of scrimming just to have the ability to learn basic shit?
People will know the spawns regardless, and you cant stop them from "camping them like crazy."
The question would be: how long it would take for all players to learn this information?

I say, FuckingRightNao.

With the icons present, the more talented team will still win the match, and it is open for anyone and everyone to have the ability to exert their control of the map by raping the spawner.
TLC has not played asylum as much as I, and if he is able to kill me, he should be able to immediately look at a spawn while restocking health/armor/ammo and have the opportunity to rape me as I rush a respawn in an attempt to 'nade him and finish him off.
Just the way it should be.

Deathmatch - do you get it?

The aspects of a "pr0-style" game that players should be expected/required to practice is how to control a particular map, advanced movement and speed, aim, and proper placement of spam. Why the fuck do you have to add in spawn points to that list?
It already takes enough of a players time to become proficient at the qualities listed.
All this in a game that is NOT competition worthy. Lawl.

I still do enjoy the "barely positive" aspects of hl2dm, but an exciting and balanced version of it will not happen on this engine.
Perhaps not in this community either.

The spawn rape will happen regardless if their is fucking icons on the spawn or not; it's just having them in there makes it fair for nerds and non-nerds alike.

If you do not like spawn-killing Dal, please put a TF2 logo on your hat and move on.

tl; dr

Except for like the first paragraph.

Sure there's spawn camping, no need to encourage it by SHOWING people where the spawns are, learn the fuckin map like you had to for all the others kthx.

Imma go get mah shine-box nao mastah

Stop being such a mentally mundane bum looker.

Fuck.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3n0vBcW5fc

Video related.

hi Valar, is there already a fixed version out without the infinity RPGs?

http://www.hl2dm-university.com/forum/p ... f=5&t=5583
working on some issues

bump